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   Old Thread  #129 3 Jul 2020 at 3.08pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #128
Absolutely, don't get me wrong, I use one where I currently dangle and other ****s still manage to upset me with theirs/general behaviour

On the other hand how about this, I turned up a couple of weeks ago and someone had cracked a marker float off and just left it, which wouldn't have been so bad if it wasn't sat right in the middle of my spot, spent about an hour trying to get the bloody thing in by casting at it but it wouldn't have it, completely wrecked my chances in that swim in the process, bloody marker floats!
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   Old Thread  #128 3 Jul 2020 at 2.51pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #127
If you can do that without coloured flashing lights and scorchio headtorches it is indeed the perfect scenario. You can also get 3 bags or singles out with very little disturbance. Really talking about busy open access waters here but if you are turning up at prime time it is you responsibility to cause minimum disturbance. Of course we all want to get fishing as effectively as possible but not just do your thing and stuff everyone else. Used to be called etiquette, I call it good manners.
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   Old Thread  #127 3 Jul 2020 at 1.38pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #126
That's the perfect scenario especially when you have your spots saved on the autopilot, 3 trips (or 4) and done
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   Old Thread  #126 3 Jul 2020 at 10.58am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #124
Alternatively...ÖÖÖ.you have to work late on a Friday, it's autumn, and you turn up at the lake just on dusk. It's bite time and you know where you want to fish so drop 3 rigs as quickly and quietly as possible from a bait boat while baiting up at the same time.

The other option would be get the marker and rods out (at least 4 casts) and spod well into dark ruining your chances and those around you.

The above was another contributing factor when I purchased a bait boat. If they are used sensibly they can work to everyones advantage.

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   Old Thread  #125 3 Jul 2020 at 10.50am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #124
Iíd rather all that than they spod and marker at bite time.
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   Old Thread  #124 3 Jul 2020 at 10.04am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
How to upset me with a bait boat. Turn up in a group of three on an 8 acre lake just on dusk. You know the one, bite time. Out with boat each and spend 30-40 mins apparently mapping swims. Dark now, death Ray headtorches on full and boats lit up with lights of every colour, flashing, strobing and glowing. Three rods each to be baited and end tackles to be placed. 100 yards of bank and water looking like Blackpool illuminations for a couple of hours. Other side of lake, maybe 60-80 yds away there are scorch marks on my bivvy from those Stupid headtorches and my blood pressure is at dangerous levels. Don't want a ban but if you have to use tech to catch carp a bit of sense and consideration is appreciated.
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   Old Thread  #123 3 Jul 2020 at 9.51am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #122
If we can smile about it now then some good must have come out of it in the end.

Surprised more than annoyed at the time but end of the day itís only a fish and itís going to be there next time anyway.
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   Old Thread  #122 3 Jul 2020 at 9.40am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Iím only pulling your leg, Iím sure the disturbance was annoying. I just found the hyperbole of Ďwavesí amusing.
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   Old Thread  #121 3 Jul 2020 at 9.37am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #119
Maybe it does sound a little dramatic but it was in a relatively small bay /inlet so the waves bounced back from the banks and also bear in mind the boat went across my swim, spun around which generated the biggest disturbance then back across again to go home.
This was just above the carps head which I never saw again. As sir B says it can be bit of a delicate art especially if the carp has left its cover and is out of its comfort zone
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   Old Thread  #120 3 Jul 2020 at 0.00am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #119
It may sound a bit dramatic but if you are delicately trying to present a floater to cautious fish and an unnecessary wave from a plastic boat upsets it may feel like waves everywhere.
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   Old Thread  #119 2 Jul 2020 at 10.33pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #114
I think Ďwaves everywhereí may be being a little over dramatic from a plastic model boat..
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   Old Thread  #118 2 Jul 2020 at 8.53pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #117
This would have been in the late 2000's or early 2010's I think, although I'm not sure. Certainly some were using bait boats in that period as I fished it a few times in that period.
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   Old Thread  #117 2 Jul 2020 at 2.03pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #115
about why bait boats were banned on Virginia Water.

They were already banned back in the 80's when I fished there (for pike). However, it is amazing how well a decoy duck body can be grafted onto a small boat (they were all home made then anyway) and at distance you had trouble spotting it. I never used one but I had a mate who did.

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   Old Thread  #116 2 Jul 2020 at 1.45pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #112
fair play too you then mate, if using a bait boat means you can carry on fishing im all for it
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   Old Thread  #115 2 Jul 2020 at 12.57pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #112
Hats off to you for continuing to fish. I suspect I will suffer similar limitations due to two operations on my right shoulder and arthritis in both now. I have noticed that I much weaker now than a few years ago, at the ripe old age of 55.

In my opinion the waters that ban bait boats do so because you will always get a small minority that have no idea how to use them in a considerate manner. Personally I have had someone bait boat a bait across the lake and drop it just to the left of my rod tips, almost certainly because they had seen me catch from my margin. We had words.

Here's an amusing story (I was told it and really hope it's true) about why bait boats were banned on Virginia Water.

It wasn't unusual for films to be shot in the grounds of Virginia Water as it's a beautiful and scenic country park and on this occasion they had set up to film an early morning scene for a Harry Potter film with the misty lake in the background. Anyway the director shouts 'Action!' quickly followed by 'CUT! WTF IS THAT!?' as a bait boat trundled quietly across the water in the background. Boats were banned shortly after that event.
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   Old Thread  #114 2 Jul 2020 at 12.57pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #1
A big part of the reason for any ban must be inconsiderate use of them. One of the lakes I fish allows them which Iím fine with as long as they donít interfere with my fishing. Recently Iíve had experience of two extreme users on the lake.
The first was only a about 10 rod lengths away but I never noticed him using it to drop bait under overhanging trees for quite a while. Very slow and quiet use so barely made any disturbance or noise, which is as it should be.
The second was when I was floater fishing, several freebies out and a carp had just shown some interest so it was looking promising until a boat came through the lot at what must have been close to full speed, did a u turn and went back to its owner the other side of the lake. Waves everywhere and no sign of the carp there all afternoon.
I think itís fairly obvious if the latter happened much then the lake owner would get complaints and a ban would follow
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   Old Thread  #113 2 Jul 2020 at 12.11pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #112
Not much of a fan of bait boats myself but in Mick's case I can't see any argument. Respect to him for still going most people would've given up years ago
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   Old Thread  #112 2 Jul 2020 at 11.08am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #94
if your fit enough to load & unload your car walk with all your tackle to the lake and set up then surely casting you rods out is achievable? surely all of the above does more damage to your shoulders than casting?

The damage to the shoulders gets worse all of the time. I don't carry my tackle to the lake. I am fortunate enough to fish waters where I can park behind or very close to the swim. Casting now, my left shoulder will not follow the correct arc pulling down on the rod butt. It randomly pulls left (I cannot stop it) meaning I cannot predict where the cast is going. My right shoulder is not as bad but bad enough that I cannot put as much power into the cast which means the distance I fish (and I am not a long range merchant) is greatly reduced. I can hit 40 yards comfortably but not accurately. This is getting progressively worse rather quickly.

I have been angling for over 60 years and carping for getting on 46 of those. If you ever get bad arthritis you will find your self looking for some way to make life easier and I would like to continue as long as I can.
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   Old Thread  #111 2 Jul 2020 at 8.51am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #107
Agree totally, have used bait boats in the past, great tool, if used correctly. Up to the anglers if they want to use or not to use. Quite often on waters that get hammered by boats, boats are the worse thing to use
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   Old Thread  #110 1 Jul 2020 at 10.05pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #107
Good post 👍
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   Old Thread  #109 1 Jul 2020 at 9.35pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #29
Exactly this. Personal choice and the fishery rules. I have a bait boat and a member of two clubs. One of them allows boats, the other doesn't.
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   Old Thread  #108 1 Jul 2020 at 6.20pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #106
I've caught a few things with mine over the years but never a carp
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   Old Thread  #107 1 Jul 2020 at 4.17pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
what do you do then handline the ****ers in That did make me chuckle

I don't get the whole bait boat thing, it's just another aid, like a rod and reel.

Spombs are welcomed with open arms because that requires skill to snap off and leave it trailing line as a death trap for wildlife but placing it without the risk with a bait boat isn't angling.

Time is precious, we only have so many days fishing a year so I'll thrash the water to death with a marker rod and write off that day scaring the fish in my swim and possibly others as 'just something that happens'...lets not mention the increased risk of snagging by dragging the bottom, pulling for a break and leaving a trailer on the bottom, rather than using a bait boat quietly and disturbing no one.

I've done both, I can easily do both, but given the choice I prefer to use a bait boat. If someone has a better bait boat than me I don't lament it as cheating...just degrees of difference really and where you put your mark in the sand.

Yes there are idiots who abuse bait boats, but that's not the boats fault, the angler should be banned for using it dangerously, because if they're prepared to do that what else are they prepared to do 'at all costs'

@ Mal
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   Old Thread  #106 1 Jul 2020 at 4.10pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #101
I've tried to use a fleshy appendage AS a lure but with only limited success. ...

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   Old Thread  #105 1 Jul 2020 at 4.04pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
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are you ok?
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   Old Thread  #104 1 Jul 2020 at 4.00pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #103
Good luck with that.....
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   Old Thread  #103 1 Jul 2020 at 3.54pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #102
well you don't need a rod do you? you can fish as far as your receiver and transmitter will allow with nothing more than a spool of line and a hook.





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   Old Thread  #102 1 Jul 2020 at 3.19pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #101
using a bait boat a rod is not needed

what do you do then handline the ****ers in, think you are getting confused with crab fishing
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   Old Thread  #101 1 Jul 2020 at 3.16pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #95
The literal definition of angler "a person who fishes with a rod and line."

using a bait boat a rod is not needed, don't get my words twisted using a bait boat your still fishing but your not angling.

you ever seen an anglerfish with it little bait boat luring prey to their death no it uses a fleshy appendage with a lure.

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   Old Thread  #100 1 Jul 2020 at 2.52pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #97
One of the finest carp in the land has been caught a few times with the use of a bait boat by very good anglers.

Never see it mentioned in the catch report but personally I dont think it detracts from the capture at all.

All about the context...
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   Old Thread  #99 1 Jul 2020 at 12.36pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #98
exactly, also where is the line drawn between using a bait boat with a sonar, having to read the screen and judge the best spots to fish from the bank, against going out in a boat with the same sonar, then being able to use a scope so you can actually see the bottom and drop your rig on the spot while watching it land, now one scenario your considered to be cheating but the other one is 'carpy'
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   Old Thread  #98 1 Jul 2020 at 12.27pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #97
An actual situation.

Angler 1 - identifies the carps patrol route, a weedy area they like to be, rows to the island when there is no one about rakes the spot of weed and baits it every day for a week with the boat, and fishes and catches a big fish.

Angler 2 - waits in the car park Sunday lunchtime punishing weekend anglers..... drops in the going swim and fires out 3 cast them anywhere chods and also catches a big fish.

The plaudits go to Angler 2 for not using a boat.
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   Old Thread  #97 1 Jul 2020 at 12.23pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #96
There are muppets that use bait boats, but there are also plenty that don't.

Absolutely, it's not all just about dropping the rig 20 yards away under a bush on a runs water, don't forget even Terry Hearn uses one when necessary
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   Old Thread  #96 1 Jul 2020 at 12.14pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #95
The last lake I fished a bait boat made a massive difference as spodding at the 125 yards required scared the fish off (pre spomb days). I bought a boat for this simple reason. I had no problem casting the distance, but people on either side of me with bait boats had a definite advantage. Until Mark Hutchinson rocked up I was spodding 20 yards further than anyone else at Horseshoe, so I am far from lacking casting ability.

All this talk of them removing skill is relative. How many build their own rods, or even their own leads these days? I still make my own leads, but haven't built a rod for 30 years. Most modern carpers have never done either, so are they considered lacking in skill.

There are muppets that use bait boats, but there are also plenty that don't.
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   Old Thread  #95 1 Jul 2020 at 10.46am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #92
Utter tosh
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   Old Thread  #94 1 Jul 2020 at 10.32am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #93
having disability is a completely different kettle of fish but at the same time if your fit enough to load & unload your car walk with all your tackle to the lake and set up then surely casting you rods out is achievable? surely all of the above does more damage to your shoulders than casting?
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   Old Thread  #93 1 Jul 2020 at 10.07am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #92
using a bait boat is not angling

But they do help when have severe arthritis in your shoulders which severely inhibits casting.
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   Old Thread  #92 30 Jun 2020 at 10.20pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #75
old thread but here is my ten pence worth...

A rod & reel or Pole is what makes a angler a angler.

A boat with sonar is what makes a trawler man a trawler man.

using a bait boat is not angling it just trawler fishing but without the net.
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   Old Thread  #91 23 Oct 2019 at 9.51am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
I stand by the casting comment. When I was a kid I spent a few hours a week one summer holiday practicing on a field, accuracy and distance came easily after an hour or two and I can still do it now even if I haven't picked a rod up for months. Some people go on like it's some skill that takes a life time to learn, it doesn't - you can get good enough for 95%+ situations in a few hours.
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   Old Thread  #90 22 Oct 2019 at 11.24pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #89
keep at it, it worked well wiv the missus
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   Old Thread  #89 22 Oct 2019 at 4.16pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #87
I've binned my microcat, rods reals and all my gear now. I've decided to become a carp tickler. I hear it works well on trout so thought I'd have a go at catching carp this way. Not having much luck with my tickling stick at the moment, doesn't work so well under water. Any tips anyone?
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   Old Thread  #88 21 Oct 2019 at 2.24pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #87

Literally a target fish.
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   Old Thread  #87 21 Oct 2019 at 2.20pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #84
Better still, with the RC mini sub camera, locate the fish you want, stun it with the patent Korda Carp stunner, drag the bugger back to shore, net it, weigh it and once it recovers bung it back. No need for rods, reels, bait , hooks etc etc. People scoff at technology but there's a lot you can do with it! Or you could harpoon, but that would just be silly!
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   Old Thread  #86 21 Oct 2019 at 1.42pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #85
I'm pretty sure that's all I manage to do anyway.
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   Old Thread  #85 21 Oct 2019 at 1.21pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #84


Or really cut out the middle man... as we all fish catch and release, just leave the carp in the water and throw bait in with no hooks. Never have to worry about break offs, getting caught in snags or being bothered by 'nuisance fish' ever again...

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   Old Thread  #84 21 Oct 2019 at 12.41pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #83
Or just cut out the middle man and have the little arm grab the carp and drag it to the bank for you.
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   Old Thread  #83 21 Oct 2019 at 12.27pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #82
How about a modified RC submersible camera submarine with a tiny grab arm to carry the hook and bait. Great for locating clear spots that can't be easily located from the bank. Brilliant!!
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   Old Thread  #82 17 Oct 2019 at 10.42pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
For some people the issue is as simple as do you use a boat or not. Bait boats have been around for a long time - I remember seeing them used in the early '80s and i'm sure they were used before that.

However, what do you define as a bait boat ? Something that can place your rig and some freebies in a spot you navigate it too using a remote control, or something that includes a sonar, camera, GPS and navigation control ?

The last 10 years or so has seen a lot of "additions" available for boats, technology that can put your rig on a particular spot that only requires you to load the boat - you don't even have to have the skill of operating the remote control to navigate it to the spot, key in coordinates (or click on a map) and off it goes. Where do people draw the line with technology ?

And - as this thread is about boats, I won't mention the whole other can of worms brewing on that other technological "advance" - drones Ö

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   Old Thread  #81 17 Oct 2019 at 10.23pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Casting isn't difficult...casting accurately can be though!
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   Old Thread  #80 17 Oct 2019 at 9.48pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #75
The only skill it removes is casting, which isn't exactly rocket science to start with.

wow!
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   Old Thread  #79 17 Oct 2019 at 4.10pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Get an RT4 and thereís a whole world of new skills that need to be learnt
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   Old Thread  #78 17 Oct 2019 at 2.15pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #77
your Lake District and day ticker scenarios make perfect sense
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   Old Thread  #77 17 Oct 2019 at 1.40pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #76
Most bait boat users can cast... agree, impossible to know.
I own a bait boat and consider myself a good caster. Bait boats are abit of a pain in the arse, itís much easier just to cast out.
But without repeating myself on posts below I use them when required. As Iíve said below I fish a lot in the Lake District. Itís a 3 hour drive one way for me so if I turn up and all the swims that are fishable with a cast able range are taken and I have to fish say a spot where the drop off is 100 yards, in a cross wind with a whole joey mackerel then Iím not going to drive home Iíll use my bait boat.
They should be should when necessary, I would never dream of using one on your big standard day ticket lake just for the sake of it, but to be totally against them is narrow minded.
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   Old Thread  #76 17 Oct 2019 at 10.16am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #75
The only skill it removes is casting, which isn't exactly rocket science to start with. .......The only skill, you make it sound so trivial
I best most boat users can cast accurately anyway....... Not true, some but not most.
Rock guitarists defunct.....
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   Old Thread  #75 17 Oct 2019 at 8.52am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
The only skill it removes is casting, which isn't exactly rocket science to start with. I best most boat users can cast accurately anyway, I wonder if most casters have the skill to use a boat properly?

It reminds me of how rock guitarists all went mental in the late 80s / early 90s about dance music producers having no "skill" because they used computers and not guitars to make music. They were wrong - they just didnt like that a new method came along and made the "skills" they'd been practising for years and years defunct.

Lots of folks don't like change it's part of some peoples nature.
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   Old Thread  #74 17 Oct 2019 at 7.22am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
I've no problem with bait boats. I have used them before and would use them again if I could. As others have said, as long as they are used in the anglers swim and sensibly (not everyone has etiquette!) Then live and let live.
If an angler catches your target fish down the other end of the lake that you're fishing, and hes using a boat, it's you that's in the wrong place. Not just luck or cheating, as some say, of using a boat.
If boats are m classed as cheating for some, then where to we put the deeper fish finder as that can be cast about to find fish and features taking everything out of watercraft!
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   Old Thread  #73 17 Oct 2019 at 0.51am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #72
Apologies
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   Old Thread  #72 17 Oct 2019 at 0.36am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #70
I wasn't replying to your comment - I was replying to Chuffy ...
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   Old Thread  #71 17 Oct 2019 at 0.35am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #66
So we both understand the skill that was required, and that alarms make bite detection easier.

And I don't disagree with your delks comment either - my Nevilles can't cast too

Casting and location are the most important - I agree with that, but a number the skills I learnt and relied on in the 70's and 80's now have things that make them easier too. We all have more choice in how we do things now ...
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   Old Thread  #70 17 Oct 2019 at 0.25am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #69
You can still have the skill and choose not to use it ...

I know, i already said that in first few words of my last post
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   Old Thread  #69 17 Oct 2019 at 0.20am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #67
I'm not saying they, or anyone else are missing any skill.

You can still have the skill and choose not to use it ...
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   Old Thread  #68 17 Oct 2019 at 0.07am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #67
ive not suggested the skill was missing for everyone .... but boats remove the need for some ....... I dont care who uses them, its the individuals decision/conscience as to whether the resulting catch holds credibility/satisfaction.

Using a bait developed and rolled yourself holds more credibility/satisfaction than buying ready mades. Tying own rigs against buying pre-tied is the same, as is fishing heavily stocked day ticket puddles vs wild waters .... there are always short-cuts we can take to put fish on the bank and we all have to draw the line somewhere .... For me it is baitboats & sonars etc ..... It doesnt mean I would never use them in the future but i would be honest with myself and admit it isnt the same achievment as doing it all myself. Bite alarms, bedchairs, nice bivvies, and all the other modern day fishing paraphanalia has no bearing on the art of the actual catching of fish .... and that is the difference imo
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   Old Thread  #67 17 Oct 2019 at 0.04am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #64
So what particular skill are Dave Lane and Terry Hearn etc missing?
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   Old Thread  #66 16 Oct 2019 at 11.55pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #65
didn't have that skill you missed bites and caught less - try it Ö

Ive spent many a night in the 80's watching bottle tops with isotopes secured with blue tac , or days watching a spring/quiver tip, wagglers, stick floats etc ... Bite alarms are just an audible alternative, easier yes, on my eyes .... but my Delks have never put a bait on a spot
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   Old Thread  #65 16 Oct 2019 at 11.41pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #64
Use of a bait boat is a substitute for skilled casting - true.

They all make fishing easier was the point I was making.

I would also argue that bite alarms are a substitute for the skill of monitoring for a bite. You no longer have to spend extended periods watching the line/rod top/float/bobbin, and that definitely is a skill having spent many hours doing just that when I was young. If you didn't have that skill you missed bites and caught less - try it Ö

Either way, the key point is I think it is a personal thing - Bait Boat use, Bite Alarms, Self Hooking Rigs - and providing you are not adversely affecting others fishing and fish safety, I have no problem.

What other people think of fish caught by the use of a bait boat, well if it was being used sensibly, then that's their problem ...
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   Old Thread  #64 16 Oct 2019 at 11.21pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
I dont really understand the comparison between bait boats and bite alarms or anything else. Bait boats are a substitute for a skill ... Bite alarms etc do not
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   Old Thread  #63 16 Oct 2019 at 10.53pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #62
Watched a vlog of a 60+ from Holme Fen , bait boats , whole world of discussion there 😜
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   Old Thread  #62 16 Oct 2019 at 10.00pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #61
Great post and I totally agree with what you say totally
Personal point of view I have used them in the past and would do so in the future,
Itís another tool in the box just like a lot of the other bits of gear we use yes they get abused but also a bit like everything else thatís done in fishing,
To me thereís a lot more to every capture than just one thing, yes the boat will get you closer to feature etc, the rig, feeding etc still has to be spot on to catch the fish and the fish have to be there in the first place.
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   Old Thread  #61 16 Oct 2019 at 9.35pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #58
You have touched on the essence of the argument for or against the things we use to make fishing easier - it is not whether they are used or not (Bait boats, Bite Alarms, Self-hooking Rigs), nor is it the implied lack of merit in any related capture, but it is their miss-use that is the issue. A few thoughts:

I personally have used a bait boat, but used it only for creating a baited area and cast my rigs into place. That's just me. Never used one to fish in dangerous situations, or to put rigs at extreme range to save me actually moving a ton of kit to a better swim. My choice. The guy (or girl) next door is welcome to put his rigs out with a boat if he wants, as long as he fishes his own water, and fishes it safely.

I have used bite alarms for over 35 years to fish at night, with a remote receiver for the last 10 years. I used the remote to allow me to keep any action quiet rather than enabling me to socialise with mates in another swim, or sit at the bar across the road.

The descriptions in posts here describing angling situations where people use boats to fish at range may be valid. However, experience tells me that every situation never boils down to a single issue that needs to be overcome and other variables will need to be considered.

Bans of any sort are never a good thing. It all boils down to the enforcement of them. I think it is also true that bans (not just in fishing) get put in place as it is easier to ban than educate. This often leads to the majority being punished for sins of the few ..

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   Old Thread  #60 16 Oct 2019 at 7.59pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #57
No one "Deserves" the best results. Not in any hobby or sport.

I've tried my best to make sense of that statement but I cant. The most hard working, dedicate, learned and to an extent gifted, participant in any pastime deserves the best results. Its earned, not given.
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   Old Thread  #59 16 Oct 2019 at 7.36pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #58
They might get the best results but they don't deserve it as a right.

It's not a right. Its earned.
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   Old Thread  #58 16 Oct 2019 at 6.36pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #54
They might get the best results but they don't deserve it as a right.

I am all for effort equals reward but I don't really go for the dumbing down arguement (ie, bait boats make it too easy) lots of stuff we use these days make it easier to catch carp. I caught a 35 the other day - I was fast asleep at the time...
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   Old Thread  #57 16 Oct 2019 at 5.48pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #54
No one "Deserves" the best results. Not in any hobby or sport.

I have no problems with bait boats, doesn't bother me who uses one.
Each to their own.
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   Old Thread  #56 16 Oct 2019 at 4.53pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #55
Great way to live life If it donít hurt you why let it bother you.
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   Old Thread  #55 16 Oct 2019 at 4.48pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
I used to have a real hate of baitboats, until I fished a water where I was allowed to use a rowing boat. Great way to put a bed of hemp out but sometimes a lot of faff, so I bought a baitboat, sorted. Always used to cast my rigs out though.
Now, as I've got older I just feel more live and let live about fishing and life in general and really don't see any harm in someone using a baitboat as long as they're sensible. I've even lifted their ban on my lake. If it helps even one person enjoy their angling more then all's good.
I'll continue to flick my rigs out personally.
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   Old Thread  #54 16 Oct 2019 at 4.13pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #53
Surely the most accomplished, experienced, and well practiced in any sport or pastime deserve the best results?
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   Old Thread  #53 16 Oct 2019 at 3.49pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #22
In my opinion banning boats puts everyone on a level playing field. Itís the fact that incredibly average anglers can make themselves look good by using a boat that doesnít sit right in my eyes.

Take Tranters example, a tricky cast to a visible feature. If boats are banned the better angler will always catch more as a direct result of their skill. Add a boat into the equation and someone whoís never even held a rod would have the same odds.


And that's wrong why exactly? are you saying only the more accomplished anglers deserve to catch - because that's certainly how it comes across.

I don't own a bait boat.

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   Old Thread  #52 16 Oct 2019 at 2.38pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Shouldnít it just be a case of, if you have one and you are on a lake where they are allowed and you feel you can fish more effectively by doing so in a given situation, then why not. Some very good anglers use them to great effect when required, including Dave Lane, Steve Briggs, Scott Lloyd and Terry Hearn, clearly all massive Noddys.
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   Old Thread  #51 16 Oct 2019 at 9.30am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #48
Good post.
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   Old Thread  #50 16 Oct 2019 at 8.36am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #47
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   Old Thread  #49 16 Oct 2019 at 8.14am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #48
Waiting for Nashy to bring out a 200 yd baiting pole 😊 .
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   Old Thread  #48 15 Oct 2019 at 7.21pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #46
We're going to have to agree to disagree on bait boats I'm afraid.

My reasons are simple enough. Nothing to do with progress or innovation. I made no criticism of anglers with bivvies on the Orient. And to clarify the personal stash comment it was reiterating my primary point about the fish being there because it's where they live rather than purely for people to catch them and if there are areas that are unfishable then I'm good with that.

I fish for lots of reasons. Thinking time, appreciation of nature, talking to other anglers. If I blank, I blank. I'm fine with it.

I do my thing and let others do theirs and occasionally I offer my wisdom on here (that's tongue in cheek).

I know Windermere well and used to fish a lot of the lakes with my dad who managed to catch pike without a bait boat...

Best of luck to you and watch out for the swans up there. They don't take prisoners!
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   Old Thread  #47 15 Oct 2019 at 7.21pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
The problem with this argument is that Iíd guess most of the people on here who use bait boats are exactly the sort of people who wouldnít take the piss when using one. But rules are created because of the morons whoíve created issues in the past.

I guess most of the people on here know how to set up a leadcore leader properly. But they are still banned on loads of waters cos the owners canít make you take some sort of competency exam before you fish.

I fish some exceptional waters, with some highly skilled anglers, who make me look a total numpty, these are exactly the sort of place where youíd think there would be no need to have rules, but they still have them cos thereís no accounting for the odd fish at all costs, spoil it for everyone else, bellend.
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   Old Thread  #46 15 Oct 2019 at 6.43pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #43
Nothing to do with personal stash, strange comment! itís about fishing a venue as effectively as possible. If Iím on Windermere and the lake goes from a few feet in the margins to a 20ft drop off 100 yards out (like many lakes up there do ) the fish will be on the drop off. So you are basically either saying we shouldnít fish them or you have to cast as far as you can but probably blank. Absolute tosh.
Fishing has moved on, if you disapprove of anglers for example bivvy/boating on places like the orient fine..... donít criticise them, just do your own thing as by the sounds of it youíd quite like us to go back to split cane rods and bent pins for hooks.
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   Old Thread  #45 15 Oct 2019 at 5.58pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
It doesnt bother me either way tbh if someone wants to use a bait boat let them. I will say though I would much prefer someone using a bait boat to put there bait in then some idiot spombing the hell out of the water right next to me and not caring if it effects anyones else fishing.

I do own a bait boat but use my spomb more often. I only use my boat on one water only and that's because of certain pegs if you can get under a tree line it gives u a massive advantage and before anyone says it's not dangerously under the trees into snags the tree canopy stops about 5 to 6 foot above the water. As for everywhere else I dont use it but that's personal preference
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   Old Thread  #44 15 Oct 2019 at 5.57pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Luckily the only time I see them is when I fish in France. Then it amazes me watching them use them even for an under arm chuck!
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   Old Thread  #43 15 Oct 2019 at 4.31pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #41
I'm not narrow minded just because my opinion differs from yours.

As I said. If there are areas on any lake that cannot be reached and so give the fish some respite then I'm happy with that.

Cassien and Windermere weren't created for you to catch at all costs I'm afraid. The pike in Windermere aren't your own personal stash.

On commercial waters that are purpose built I guess it's up to the owner to set their own rules. As I said also, if it was me I'd have a ban.

I fish the sea from the beach too. There are loads of places I can't cast to there. I still catch and still enjoy it.
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   Old Thread  #42 15 Oct 2019 at 3.59pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #39
Imho if you only fish in what most people would call 'your swims water' i.e only half way across and only half way to each swim either side. Then you can cast , or use a catapult or method ball . Or bait boat to your hearts content. I personally fish waters. where bait boats are banned .spombing is minimal due to encouraging Bream. Also the carp are wary of heavy baiting, all the anglers in the know, bait lightly and as quietly as possible .Ffs most actually use catapults after dark because the gulls will eat 95% of what you put out in daylight. Especially if you can't put a large pouchfull out at a time. If your fishing a longer range mark then it's essential to be spombing accurately.
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   Old Thread  #41 15 Oct 2019 at 3.58pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #36
Narrow minded comment, ban them from all waters!
So you would rather have people casting into trees and onto islands and snapping rigs off into lakes rather than a bait boat. Anglers who think they can cast are more of an issue than bait boat users. Anglers who take 10 attempts to get it on a spot are more of an issue than bait boats. Anglers who spomb the water to death are more of an issue than bait boats.
Whatís your thoughts on big European waters like Cassien? Canít we fish those anymore either as you have to row your boats out in a lot of instance there as well.

According to your logic as well, as a pike angler I can no longer fish for example half the marks on Windermere because i canít cast a big mackerel bait and 3oz lead over hundred yards in a cross wind to the drop offs.
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   Old Thread  #40 15 Oct 2019 at 3.57pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
The beauty is we have the choice. On all the water I fish, and the vast majority of those I'm considering fishing, they're already banned anyway. Plenty of waters that allow them so something for all of us.
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   Old Thread  #39 15 Oct 2019 at 3.34pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Hi all

Before this goes too far, i know there are a number of very accomplished anglers on this forum who use bait boats basically for medical reasons ( be it arthritis, sciatica or other reasons).
No reason they werent better casters than most in their day and no reason for them to get grief on here or be banned from venues because of it.
Its education of the the idiots not dictatorial "nanny state" rules thats going to improve things
No real reason anyone's put forward that should lead to a ban on bait boats apart that idiots are allowed to buy them and apparently people that cant afford them want them banned?

Best

Jon
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   Old Thread  #38 15 Oct 2019 at 3.20pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #36
But you get that with people casting over your lines ..... I say ban casting if you can't use a bait boat don't go fishing
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   Old Thread  #37 14 Oct 2019 at 8.52pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #30
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   Old Thread  #36 14 Oct 2019 at 8.47pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #35


I'd ban them on all waters. If you can't cast to it then you shouldn't be able to fish it. If there are areas on a lake where the fish can be without being disturbed then fair enough.

I used to fish a venue where there were some 'regulars' who would think nothing of driving their little toy over my baits from 100 yards or more and then get p*ssy with me if I hooked and picked up their lines.

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   Old Thread  #35 14 Oct 2019 at 8.09pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #33
Yes self righteous boat owners who piss others off and think they are the problem
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   Old Thread  #34 14 Oct 2019 at 8.05pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #32
Whatever method they use to get their bait to their chosen spot no one should fish deep into snags
Perhaps one of the reasons the pole gets less attention is that they are say 18m max and your less likely to piss other people off?
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   Old Thread  #33 14 Oct 2019 at 6.27pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
This should be retitled The self righteous thread.
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   Old Thread  #32 14 Oct 2019 at 6.05pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
So where does a baiting pole sit ethically with those that have a problem with boats ?
Obviously you don't need to cast and you can poke one as far into snags as you like, but they don't get the same amount of hate as a boat as far I can see.
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   Old Thread  #31 14 Oct 2019 at 3.40pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #20
Hi


"My missus could drive a boat to an island/far bank"

And mine did, i didnt see exactly how she did it but she managed to beach it on the island, i had to row out to get it back

Best

Jon
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   Old Thread  #30 14 Oct 2019 at 3.25pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #25
@luckyjim, that's genius mate. A thinking angler
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   Old Thread  #29 14 Oct 2019 at 1.16pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #28
Thatís my point. Theyíll never be and never need to be a level playing field. We donít use the same bait or 12ft rods, some use 13fts to help them cast or better more expensive line for example. Some use deepers where some use marker Rods. Should one be banned for using technology.

Comes down to personal choice and what the lake allows.
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   Old Thread  #28 14 Oct 2019 at 12.49pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #22
I donít get the level playing field comment. Well I do but this is not an Olympic sport itís a hobby after all and if they are allowed anglers who have them should be allowed to use them and enjoy them. They should be used responsibly for example against snags but it is no different to fishing against snags anyway and at least you donít get numpties casting into trees and snapping off into the lake. You also wouldnít get the numpties spombing all over the place either.
It comes down to good baliffing for me, if anyone is on a lake taking the piss they they could be stopped.
I use mine for fishing long range (open water) on big waters and for my pike fishing in the Lake District where it is very difficult to cast large dead baits over drop offs on some waters.
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   Old Thread  #27 14 Oct 2019 at 12.48pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #13
Such sarcasm actually
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   Old Thread  #26 14 Oct 2019 at 12.43pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #25
That we'll know noddy Terry Hearne has used them .
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   Old Thread  #25 14 Oct 2019 at 12.25pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #17
I take your point, but, I was in a syndicate where there were swans & a bait boat ban, baited up, wait, the swans cleared it all, if I had been able to use a boat I would have baited up with that then cast my rig, however I did think of a way where I pushed a plastic tube through a bush into the water & rolled the boillies down to the margin then go round and cast, only 1 splash so the swans didn't investigate, I know that can't be done everywhere but sometimes we have to think outside of the box
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   Old Thread  #24 14 Oct 2019 at 12.14pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #22
It doesnt though. so and so can afford better rods, so and so has more experience, so and so can be a time bandit etc etc.

You still need to know how do things like finding the fish, feeling the bottom with a lead, moving onto showing fish etc etc to catch using a boat. It just makes certain aspects slightly easier. This is balanced by the fact that boats tend to be a right pain in the ass to use, they are slow, you need to lug them and the batteries around, TBH casting for me is a lot easier and more convenient than using the boat but the boat catches me a LOT more fish.
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   Old Thread  #23 14 Oct 2019 at 12.08pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #22
Yeah I see your point and makes sense. The other day I found a clear area on a far margin. Could bait up and see it perfect from the margin. Casting to it was 110 yards in a cross wind. I knew this would take a few casts to get near to where Iíd be happy. Used the boat and was on the spot first time. No disturbance and caught. Where as casting may have ruined the swim for hours or completely.

For me Iím there to catch fish not prove I can cast 110 yards. Again Iíve fished for 20+ years and would always promote learning before technology. But I wouldnít not use whatís there to be used either.

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   Old Thread  #22 14 Oct 2019 at 11.59am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #21
In my opinion banning boats puts everyone on a level playing field. Itís the fact that incredibly average anglers can make themselves look good by using a boat that doesnít sit right in my eyes.

Take Tranters example, a tricky cast to a visible feature. If boats are banned the better angler will always catch more as a direct result of their skill. Add a boat into the equation and someone whoís never even held a rod would have the same odds.
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   Old Thread  #21 14 Oct 2019 at 11.47am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
While I love my boat I can understand why they get banned. Firstly (irks me to admit this) they aren't really an "at one with nature" kind of thing and to lots of anglers they are an a front to the peace and quiet and general scenery. Some think that they don't need skill or are lazy angling. Those people clearly have no experience of using a remote control boat or they've never really seen one used well. Also you do get the odd tool with them and in the hands of a tool they can create a lot of un needed disturbance and can even be downright dangerous. Some people just don't like new fangled things and would rather everyone still used wooden rods and cat gut.

The poor people cast argument isn't really true but is still funny as hell and usually gets a bite on facey
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   Old Thread  #20 14 Oct 2019 at 11.45am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #17
Nail on the head Yonny mate . My missus could drive a boat to an island/far bank.
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   Old Thread  #19 14 Oct 2019 at 9.12am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #17
100% agree.
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   Old Thread  #18 14 Oct 2019 at 9.04am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #17
Yeah I agree 100% , should always learn the trade first. But after 10 years thereís tools to be used to do the job easier.

Iíd encourage anyone to perfect casting over boats. But if your on a day session one bad cast or casting 3 times to creep towards snags or trees could be all it takes to ruin the day.
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   Old Thread  #17 14 Oct 2019 at 8.54am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #16
Only takes one Bad cast and the peg could be ruined for the day. Bait boat with little disturbance gets you there first time.

See for me that is replacing skill with tech buddy.
Is there a place for bait boats? Probably. For disabled anglers defo. For extreme range maybe.
But to replace angling skill is a complete cop out imo.
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   Old Thread  #16 14 Oct 2019 at 8.47am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Bait boats can be a brilliant bit of kit. Casting to a tree line or snags . Only takes one Bad cast and the peg could be ruined for the day. Bait boat with little disturbance gets you there first time. Thereís bait boats for all peoples costs and abilities.

Biggest is as mentioned , people using them to go 4 pegs Down Around the corner over the jungle climbing frame, On to the Bar.

If used with respect and within reason there brilliant.
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   Old Thread  #15 14 Oct 2019 at 8.22am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #11
Spot on.
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   Old Thread  #14 14 Oct 2019 at 7.56am Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
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Lol. Load of tosh.
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   Old Thread  #13 13 Oct 2019 at 10.19pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
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I HATE this as an argument. Such naivety .
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   Old Thread  #12 13 Oct 2019 at 9.50pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #1
It ensures anglers fish to their abilities
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   Old Thread  #11 13 Oct 2019 at 8.18pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #3
I wouldn't say only noddies use bait boats pal.
Alot of decent carp anglers out there use them
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   Old Thread  #10 13 Oct 2019 at 8.01pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Mainly because too many overnight carpers put rigs in places where getting the fish out could be bad angling and dangerous to the fish plus too many noddies drive them more miles dropping rigs everywhere on a lake than I do In my motor
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   Old Thread  #9 13 Oct 2019 at 7.35pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Same as any ban it boils down to one thing... ****s
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   Old Thread  #8 13 Oct 2019 at 7.32pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
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What a load of ********
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   Old Thread  #7 13 Oct 2019 at 6.39pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
In reply to Post #1
I find the most common reason is that most people who object cant afford one themselves.
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   Old Thread  #6 13 Oct 2019 at 5.37pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
They often encourage people with limited abilities to drop baits in areas that theyíd never dream of casting to, like into snags. Also the temptation is to motor the boat out way further than they could cast and often into other anglers water.

Less common is if one goes wrong the angler isnít likely to leave it jammed in snags etc, and might risk doing something stupid like swimming or wading out to retrieve it.
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   Old Thread  #5 13 Oct 2019 at 5.30pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Same reason there are other types of bans because youíve always got to cater for the lowest common s denominator 😉
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   Old Thread  #4 13 Oct 2019 at 5.19pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
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Hmm
Noddies donít only use bait boats lol
Some have been known to use chods
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   Old Thread  #3 13 Oct 2019 at 4.51pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Keeps the noddies out the clubs.
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   Old Thread  #2 13 Oct 2019 at 4.34pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
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The main reason, irresponsible angling, to much bait and angling at huge distances.
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   Old Thread  #1 13 Oct 2019 at 4.22pm Login so you can post / reply  Register so you can join in!
Why are Bait Boats banned on most waters,, what is the reason for this ?????? could understand if they were petrol operated.
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