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The end is nigh
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mal

Posts: 4857

#1005 21 Dec 2019 at 8.25pm

In reply to Post #1004
Just the start of a slippery slope scozza

Cobhams today, the NHS soon to go. Won't be long before Greggs is selling mom's apple pie and Hershey's pastries....

scozza

Posts: 12143

#1004 21 Dec 2019 at 7.54pm

In reply to Post #999
That s something that I am passionate about and close to my heart. We were once the pioneers and leaders of most things in manufacturing and it�s all been pilfered and took away by buy outs over the years, bought the company, raped the technology and shut it down. Makes my ****ing blood boil

spanker

Posts: 618

#1003 21 Dec 2019 at 7.51pm

In reply to Post #998
Define "Great Britain" but more importantly , who was it great for ?

ralph69

Posts: 10041

#1002 21 Dec 2019 at 7.09pm

In reply to Post #998
Couldn't agree more , merry brexit , I mean Christmas

spanker

Posts: 618

#1001 21 Dec 2019 at 5.53pm

In reply to Post #1000
well , this is not what i have been led to believe by this Tory lot led by Bulls##t Boris

why are our press and media not holding him to account ?

Legal disputes and other matters
Provisions for these issues are also unchanged from the original withdrawal deal.

Although a joint UK-EU committee and an arbitration panel would try to resolve disputes, the UK would remain under the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice (ECJ) during the transition. Afterwards, its rulings would no longer have direct effect in the UK but it would retain influence.

One contentious issue � that of fishing rights � is left to be dealt with on another day. The agreement says the EU and UK should do their best to strike a separate deal on access to UK waters for EU fishing boats.

A protocol on Gibraltar � the British territory on the southern tip of Spain � seeks to ensure in particular that citizens� rights are respected. Another, on Cyprus, aims to preserve the current situation � keeping the British military base in the EU�s customs territory.

spanker

Posts: 618

#1000 21 Dec 2019 at 5.37pm

In reply to Post #999
A layman�s summary of the EU�s new �UK colonisation treaty� agreed by the PM yesterday
1. Parliament will not be sovereign - UK still to be governed by existing and new laws of the ECJ � a foreign court � and
with no say over these laws. [WA articles 4, 87, 89 and 127, PD para 131]
2. Demands payment of a sum to be decided by the EU - Minimum �39 billion but this is likely to increase and the
EU decides the final sum. This must be paid BEFORE any trade deal is agreed. [WA articles 138-144, and 152-155]
3. No trade deal with EU � Not included as this is just a divorce treaty. Any EU trade deal must ensure �a level playing field
for open and fair competition� and �deep regulatory and customs cooperation�. This will make it difficult for the UK to reduce
non-tariff barriers in trade deals with USA, Australia, China, etc. [PD paras 17 & 21]
4. Prevents independent tax policy - Political Declaration still obliges UK to adopt a future relationship which will impose
EU State Aid rules and �relevant tax matters� on the UK. EU specifically intends to curb UK�s ability to have �harmful tax
practices�. Withdrawal Treaty also applies EU law to UK during transition period - allowing EU to sue UK, including infringement
proceedings for as yet unidentified breaches of State Aid rules and billions in VAT on commodity derivative transactions dating
back to 1970s. [PD para 77, WA articles 86, 93, 127].
5. Restricts independent foreign policy - UK to be bound by international agreements concluded by the EU despite
having no influence in their negotiation during the transition period and must �refrain, during the transition period, from any
action... which is likely to be prejudicial� to the interests of the EU. [Articles 129(3) and (6)].
6. Prevents independent military action � UK permanently stopped from taking �any action likely to conflict with or
impede� EU�s foreign policies. Critical parts of section on foreign policy and security are not reciprocal, eg future relationship will
not �prejudice the decision-making autonomy of the EU� but no such language for UK � only permitted to �maintain the right
to determine how [to respond] to any invitation to participate in operations or missions�. Also, parties �agree to consider�
security collaboration in European Defence Agency, European Defence Fund, and PESCO �to the extent possible under [EU law]�
which is prescriptive (not permissive) obligation. Despite paying for European Defence Agency during transition, British troops in
EU battlegroups will not be led by British staff officers. [WA articles 129(6-7) and 156-157 and PD paras 99, 102(c)]
7. Controls UK fishing � Common Fisheries Policy continues in UK waters during transition (which can be extended) but UK
will have no say in implementation or enforcement. After transition, Political Declaration requires �cooperation on... regulation
of fisheries, in a non-discriminatory manner� - code for continuing current arrangements for EU access to UK waters. Any trade
deal to �ensure service providers and investors are treated in a non-discriminatory manner, including with regard to
establishment� - prevents UK protecting quotas from EU purchase. [PD paras 29 and 72]
8. Replaces one EU Commission with another - New body established with �powers equivalent to those of the
European Commission�. UK must accept exclusive jurisdiction of Arbitration Panel and judgments of ECJ. Grants EU officials
criminal immunity and exemption from UK tax. Imposes gagging order on UK which must keep all EU information confidential
but EU can use UK information as it sees fit. [WA articles 74, 101, 104-5, 106-116, 159, 168, 174]
9. Leaves UK with �500bn liabilities from EU Investment Bank but no profits - No rights to past and future
profits made from UK investment in EIB, no rights to UK share of assets of EIB, yet UK remaining liable for risk of up to �500bn of
guarantees. UK must let EU bid for UK public projects at least during transition. [WA articles 34, 75-78, 127, 143, 147, 150].
10. EU colonisation - makes UK bystander in laws that govern it - UK permitted to send civil servant to Brussels to observe
EU passing laws designed to disadvantage UK economy during transition which might last many years. EU could regulate
London�s huge foreign exchange markets, impose financial transaction tax that would be collected at UK expense by HMRC but
sent to foreign governments. [WA article 34]

ocelot

Posts: 775

#999 21 Dec 2019 at 5.21pm

In reply to Post #998
Those mentioned in the first sentence, it's their choice.
The second sentence will be agreed by everyone Mook.
One of the UK's best aerospace/ defence companies, Cobham, was allowed to be sold last night at 10pm by Boris. Strange time to announce it but he probably has reasons.....To a US private equity company against the wishes and advice of the British founders and Trade Unions.
So much for taking back control, looks like Britain is still for sale to me under this government.
Wayne, yeah right yeah...
Merry Christmas.

mook

Posts: 143

#998 21 Dec 2019 at 4.46pm

Ralphy� scozza and wayne, i have the same views as you people.
i really just want my country to have some backbone� dignity and to resemble something nearer to when it actually was great britain.
regardless of peoples views, we�re leaving europe� i never wanted to join, so its time everybody got used to the idea. we need a bit of faith and belief. it may be a bumpy ride, it may not but� we will all make the journey and hopefully it will be or the better. some are to young to remember when we had our own rules and laws� and did things our way. it was a lot better then �opinion� and although we might not get back that greatness� who knows� at least we�re giving it a shot and standing on our own feet again.

whatever your views, have a great christmas all

mal

Posts: 4857

#997 21 Dec 2019 at 4.04pm

In reply to Post #996
Well let's hope for some change for the better eh?

Look at that. Some discussion that didn't result in anyone being a d***

Wayne

Posts: 16362

#996 21 Dec 2019 at 3.53pm

In reply to Post #994
Agreed but I don�t think there is many contracts out there that offer very little protection or exploit workers. I mean the EU working directive for instance that�s a great idea but most people I know signed out of it because they want to work more hours.

EU is slightly concerned by all accounts as we are about to become competition to them hence why they want a similar alignment to the rules and regs they already have. This will be a big factor in the trade negotiations I think.

Edit - Ocelot it was a tongue in cheek initial comment!

ocelot

Posts: 775

#995 21 Dec 2019 at 3.50pm

In reply to Post #988
You have no idea about workers rights, fair enough.
13 minutes later you come to a conclusion

mal

Posts: 4857

#994 21 Dec 2019 at 3.48pm

In reply to Post #993
Labour may have brought them in but nobody has gotten rid of them in the last 9 years..

At least we agree that they are Crap.

As for not taking a job if you don't agree with everything in a contract, I'm afraid that decision is a luxury all can afford. We should be pushing for a system that doesn't have contracts that exploit people shouldn't we?

Wayne

Posts: 16362

#993 21 Dec 2019 at 3.25pm

In reply to Post #992
Zero hour contracts are crap but look who brought them in......labour! Trade unions are exactly what you say and offer no solutions to workers other than striking. When you sign a work contract you should read it to be fair, anything you don�t like you ask to be amended or don�t take the job.

My understanding of child refugees is the parents are already here and now want there children brought over. That doesn�t sit well with me at all. Another point, I wish the government would take the stance of no benefits of any kind are available in this country unless you have worked here for a minimum of 3 years and even then the handout is only equivalent of NI contributions in that time. This should apply to all not just people from the EU!

mal

Posts: 4857

#992 21 Dec 2019 at 3.12pm

In reply to Post #991
Hmmmm

I'm definitely no fan of the hard left trade unionists who use strike action to hold people to ransom but I can't agree with disbanding them all and leaving many honest hard working people without some forms of protection in employment. Look at the way zero hours contracts are exploited.

As for refugee children it doesn't sit right with me that they become victims of what looks to be an inhumane approach. There are lots of reasons why a child could end up separated from family (parents could have been killed and they are looking to find other family as an example ). The key thing for me is that it's not the fault of the child.

As I said already I'm hoping for positive change but I'm not overly impressed with a start that looks a bit like more broken promises.

Wayne

Posts: 16362

#991 21 Dec 2019 at 2.47pm

In reply to Post #989
Quick google and I�m not sure they were needed. I mean how the hell does someone come here without there kids......

Workers rights......seems like the trade unions are shouting the most and to be fair there a pain in the arse and should be disbanded......


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