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Don't know if Pete still comes on here. If he does I hope he does not mind me posting this for the previous poster:
OK after so many requests here are a couple of simple base mixes to base your own baits around. There is nothing clever here just simple balanced nutrition and if you take any of these as a base and then add your chosen attractors you won’t be going far wrong.
BM1 (basic HNV mix)
30% LT94 fishmeal
15% Maize Protein Meal 60% (supergold 60)
13% Egg based bird food like CeDe
10% Semolina
10% Soya flour (heat treated)
8.5% pre-digested fishmeal
8.5% Calf or lambs milk powder such as Vitamelo
5% Equivite
Depending on the exact brand of milk powder and bird food you use this will give you a bait with over 50% crude protein and about 10% oil content. Although they sound a little high it will come down if you add a few attractors to it yourself. If you really want to know the FLAA is Phenylaline, the 2nd is Methionine and the 3rd is Threonine……but all are plenty high enough to allow the carp maximum utilisation of the protein in the bait.
I have deliberately left the solubles a little on the low side so that you can add your own soluble attractors such as Betaine, MSG, liver powder etc without the bait falling to pieces in the water after 10 minutes!
Now another mix I have played with and had some promising result on before I stopped bait development was slightly different. Lower fish meal due to increased costs and slightly higher energy was the initial goal.
BM2
22% Poultry protein meal
20% LT94
10% Maize Protien Meal 60% (supergold 60)
10% pre-digested fishmeal
10% Calf or lambs milk powder such as Vitamelo
7% Micronized Soya meal
6% Semolina
2.5% Micronised crushed hemp
2.5% Equivite
Again the crude protein level is above 50% but the lipids levels are higher. The 1st, 2nd and 3rd LAA are the same as the above mix although the balance is not quite as good. As with BM1 you can add your attractors to this. If you find it too soft (I like it that way and the attractors can just pour out) then try adding 2 or 3% egg albumin.
For a simple bait take any of these and add 20ml per Kg of good quality oil such as Cod liver or Salmon, a few ml of flavour if you want some and 8-10 eggs per Kg of base mix.
Two of the best recipes you will ever encounter...Nothing more needs saying 
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 #537 9 May 2020 at 6.48pm | |   |
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In reply to Post #536
My advise would be to stick to a proven recipe as in post 1 until you know what you're doing. Good luck.
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#536 9 May 2020 at 1.23pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
hi
i am new in boilies and i need your help !
i have a recipe and i need to know if are ok or must add more or...must modify:
Mix:
Squid Meal: 200g
Prosecto: 100g
Pre-digested fsh meal 100g
semolina 100g
clo 150g
Robinred 80g
WPC80 50g
Purifyed blood powder 50g
soya flour 100g
salt 20g
chili powder 10g
GLM 20g
Betain 20g
Liquid:
Black pepper oil: 1,5ml
Squid extract 30ml
Fruit flawor: 5ml
thanks
Sweetcorn sirup ?
CSL ?
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#535 2 May 2020 at 11.39pm | | |
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In reply to Post #533
About 7.5-8kg finished bait! As for number of individual baits, that depends on what size you roll! You will get more 10mm baits than you will 15mm & less 18mm baits than 16mm.
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#534 2 May 2020 at 12.42pm | | |
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What is the flavoured essence to betaline ratio ?
Rule of thumb. 👍
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#533 18 Apr 2020 at 11.15pm | | |
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In reply to Post #532
How many boilies will i get from 6kg of BM1 basemix?
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#532 14 Apr 2020 at 10.26am | | |
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In reply to Post #77
May be giving BM1 a go later this year! only making small batches though due to money.
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#531 21 Feb 2020 at 8.26pm | | |
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Hi all going to be rolling the bm1 this year could any body advise on a liquid attractor pack was thinking bafs bechalin hydro thanks
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#530 5 Dec 2019 at 10.37am | | |
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In reply to Post #529
You don’t have to have it.
But if you wanted to have a vitamin/mineral in its place that is cheaper.
You could substitute Equivite for Crunchy Kelp meal
( £3.00 for 1 kilo ) from CCMoore 
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#529 4 Dec 2019 at 7.43pm | | |
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In reply to Post #528
So i am looking at making BM1, ive never made baits beofre and wondered whether this would be alright. do i need equivite as im on a budget?
30 lt94
15 maize protien
13 megablend
10 semolina
10 soya flour
8.5 PDFM
8.5 Vitamelo
( all from ccmoore)
Is there anything else i need to add to the mix? i am unsure on what else to add.
cheers,
Hunter
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#528 4 Dec 2019 at 7.16pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
So is the pinned post the final recipe for BM1?
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#527 29 Nov 2019 at 11.01am | | |
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In reply to Post #77
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#526 25 Oct 2019 at 8.04pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Hi. Im making that mix a few time now and i saw it many times to become pop up... What is wrong??? I do something wrong or is any flour off??? Help me plz
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#525 1 Sept 2019 at 9.25am | | |
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In reply to Post #524
Hardly simple and 60% binders. The Pete B mix is far more simple and better balanced and cheaper. Now, which one should I pick? 
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#524 1 Sept 2019 at 4.12am | | |
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In reply to Post #515
25% semolina
25% maiz meal
10% lt fismeal
10% soy meal full fat and toasted
8% egg powder
5% yeast
5% kelp
2% chili powder
5% milk powder
5% pre-digested fishmeal
30ml hydrolyzed fish liquid (krill, tuna, salmon, what you can find)
No eggs are needed due to the egg powder => use water to moisturize the mix
This mix is way below 4GBP/kg and catches every where
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#523 30 Aug 2019 at 7.17pm | | |
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In reply to Post #520
ive had a good bit of success using their HNV Spicy Red Fish & Bird, rolls very nice too 
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#522 19 Aug 2019 at 1.10pm | | |
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In reply to Post #521
yes, that's their tried and trusted recipe. Squid and orange I think it is.
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#521 17 Aug 2019 at 8.37pm | | |
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In reply to Post #520
Yes i will be trying patshull park. They recomended it too. With a squid flavouring!
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#520 17 Aug 2019 at 8.32pm | | |
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In reply to Post #517
No. Go for the HNV mixes. They're only a bit more money and much better quality. Try the one I suggested, patsull Park. A good mix with a proven pedigree.
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#519 16 Aug 2019 at 8.58am | | |
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In reply to Post #518
Right so spend a little more and get the fishmeal base. I shall certainly go with that next
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#518 16 Aug 2019 at 8.54am | | |
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In reply to Post #517
Errr... yes, that right. I’m sure it’s a very good 50/50 mix, but I’d expect MUCH better results with a cheap/simple fishmeal mix than a cheap/simple carbohydrate mix.
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#517 15 Aug 2019 at 9.46pm | | |
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In reply to Post #516
Brilliant thanks.
Also in reply to the above post about quality baits. That stuffs relatively cheap right?? So say a kilo of the 50/50 plus eggs , oil and a flavour then im in business right???
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#516 15 Aug 2019 at 9.33pm | | |
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In reply to Post #515
50% fishmeal
40% nectablend/red factor/megablend ...or even even semolina
10% calf milk replacer or dried milk powder
Oil/flavour optional
Put it in the right place at the right time and a carp will happily eat this. If you want to play, you can add seaweed meal, yeast, shrimp paste, etc, etc...
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#515 15 Aug 2019 at 5.21pm | | |
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In reply to Post #514
Ive got ccmoore live system base mix and ive been rolling that myself. But want to start with something simple from scratch.
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#514 15 Aug 2019 at 10.08am | | |
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In reply to Post #512
If you don't know what some of the ingredients are then I suggest you buy a ready made base mix then roll it yourself. Something like Patsull Park base mix by Quality baits would be a good start point. It's also got krill in it.
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#513 14 Aug 2019 at 9.54pm | | |
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In reply to Post #352
I like this a lot. Much more simple to follow. But say i want a krill boilie how much would i need instead of plum flavour??
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#512 14 Aug 2019 at 9.24pm | | |
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Hey guys. New here and this is my first post. Me and a friend want to bring our bait costs down as much as possible. So i made the first move by using the ccmoore bait packs. Which has got me down to around 5.40 a kilo.
So my question is. As a newbie to bait rolling whats simple and cost effective for me to start on?
Ive read 90% of the posts and theres ingredients ive never heard of!
I thought it was simple like 2 or 3 dry ingredients plus flavour plus eggs and oil job done!
Look forward to your replies..
Keep rolling and tight lines!
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#511 12 Aug 2019 at 7.32pm | | |
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In reply to Post #509
If you want to get the price down more then you need to factor in postage. BAF's CLO for example is a bit more expensive than the Ccmoore one (it's far superior too in my opinion) but buying it from BAF along with the other bits would bring the cost down as there's not a second lot of postage. Ccmoore would charge you £9.50 for the postage on your vanilla meal and clo.
Unless you're collecting of course in which case I'd still get the BAF clo as it's much better.
The BAF csl is very active, you'll be absolutely fine with that.
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#510 11 Aug 2019 at 11.16am | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Hi guys,
Has anyone found a good rolling company that will roll BM1? I know it sounds lazy but with other commitments my fishing time is too short to spend it rolling bait. I’m just a little nervous that some bait rollers might substitute cheaper materials for those in BM1. Any recommendations much appreciated.
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#509 11 Jun 2019 at 7.28pm | | |
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In reply to Post #508
molecular weight of aluminium hydroxide
well i've done another table with your suggestions smurf
the final price per kg looks very appealing no factoring the eggs in which i can imagine will drop the price per kg abit also?
The corn steep liquor is a few pounds cheaper from BAF than CC Moore, they both say there active is there any difference between them or im i fine going with BAF?
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#508 11 Jun 2019 at 4.31pm | | |
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In reply to Post #506
Not sure that level of GLM is worth the effort (some use up to 10%) and I never tried with a level lower than 2.5% and at that level it was really tailing off in any noticeable affect.
Personally I still quite like this mix but swap half the Maize Protein meal for Vanilla Extract meal (which some hate but the carp love it) and then add 2% Spirulina and 1% Betaine and a little (10-20ml per kg of dry mix) CSL liquid when mixing
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#507 11 Jun 2019 at 1.59pm | | |
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In reply to Post #506
Just try making it as it is without adding anything apart from maybe some oil, you'll be pleasantly surprised
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#506 10 Jun 2019 at 10.47pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Hello i've put together BM1 into a chart to see how much it would cost my additives are Betaine HCL at 1% and Green Lipped Mussel at 1% is this adequate or should i change the percentages of both?
any advice would be helpful
gaz.
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#505 9 Sept 2018 at 11.54am | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Hi I can see loads of good recipes ..
But does anyone have an idea on pellet recipes ???
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#504 21 Dec 2017 at 3.38pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Trying to put together a recipe for next year, any advice?
30% LT94 fishmeal
15% Maize Protein Meal 60% (supergold 60)
8% Robin Red
5% Meggablend
10% Semolina
10% Soya flour (heat treated)
8.5% pre-digested fishmeal
8.5% Calf or lambs milk powder such as Vitamelo
5% Equivite? Is there anything similar on ccmoore I can use instead of this?
Thanks 
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#503 29 Apr 2017 at 10.57pm | | |
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In reply to Post #501
However, for those who can afford to create the ultimate bait, how would we change it?
Simple.
Just take any time proven bait recipe and just apply it better, more often & to more areas in your venue, give the fish more free food without hooks, to get them really wanting it.
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#502 11 Apr 2017 at 12.53pm | | |
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In reply to Post #501
The mix has all you need, why change for the sake of it? They are only fish, not gourmets in some high class restaurant. The only thing I would add to this mix is a good dollop of hydrolyzed fish liquid in with the eggs. Anything else is superfluous. In fact, I would take some things out rather than add them.
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#501 10 Apr 2017 at 6.58am | | |
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Hi all,
First post. Please be gentle...
Fascinating thread. Thanks to all who have contributed.
How would we change this mix if money was no issue? I know there is already a cheap bait thread and this appears to be a very good value HNV mix (and I note that smurf already clarified that it was a good value HNV, not a cheap HNV mix).
With limitless money, what would we change? Would we up the GLME/ RR/ Pre- dig?
I appreciate that not everyone can afford such changes and some would regard them as "buying your fish". However, for those who can afford to create the ultimate bait, how would we change it? Also, I know that the ultimate bait can be out fished off the next swim by a pack of shelf life tuttis....
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#500 13 Jan 2017 at 3.37pm | | |
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Hello,
I need some help about these boilie mix.
100g megablend
100g soya
100g protein concentrate
100g tiger nut flour
100g cornflour
100g hemp/millet seeds
150g wheat biting
150g rye flour
50g lamlac
30g birdfood (minced)
20g peanut flour
Is this a good balance of foods?
Thanks a lot!
Regards,
Mario
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#499 12 Aug 2016 at 11.04am | | |
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In reply to Post #498
That is what the search option is for mate.
Type into KEYWORDS, dip glug and tick the FORUM topic, bait, search.
plenty of posts on your subject of interest.
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#498 9 Aug 2016 at 6.44pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Changing the subject slightly, but does anyone know how I could make my own dip/glug for home-made boilies?
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#497 15 Jun 2016 at 1.57pm | | |
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In reply to Post #496
Would that be a yes ??? Or what about a low oil peanut meal ??? It's only 40g that needs replacing in the mix
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#496 15 Jun 2016 at 1.26pm | | |
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In reply to Post #495
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#495 15 Jun 2016 at 7.25am | | |
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In reply to Post #493
Post 458 mate was what I was referring to . 
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#494 14 Jun 2016 at 9.05pm | | |
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In reply to Post #493
I was referring to the mix that smurf has tweaked the hydrolyzed poultry meal is no longer available was wondering if you could use either of the to instead
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#493 14 Jun 2016 at 8.32pm | | |
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In reply to Post #492
BM1 - Why change it ? it works, and you know it works 
Personally I think Pea protein is the latest bait fad, snapping at the heels of the other carp Tax buzzwords containing ...Krill, Tuna, and anything that is Nut based 
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#492 14 Jun 2016 at 6.02pm | | |
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In reply to Post #458
Hi all new to the forum . I have been using the original bm1 for a couple of years now very good bait put fishes all the bait my mates use . I've been looking at the below recipe and would it be possible to use hydrolyzed feather meal or yellow pea isolate powder as both have a good amino acid profile and protein content just a thought
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#491 13 Apr 2016 at 6.52am | | |
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In reply to Post #490
See post #488 & reply at #499 (directly below your post) for your first answer
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#490 13 Apr 2016 at 3.14am | | |
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Hey.
I joined up just for this thread.
I'm going to be making baits for the first time and have some questions of you don't mind answering them for me please fella's ?
I can't find anywhere that sells hydrolysed poultry meal in the uk. Would it be ok just to use a a fish mean in its place like salmon or krill for example or can someone point me in its direction.
And when it's says the liquid element 10 eggs use 50ml of CSL and 5ml of your chosen attractors
Is that ten eggs per Kg ? Then 55ml per kg of base mix of liquids ??
Cheers
Callam
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#489 5 Apr 2016 at 11.20am | | |
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In reply to Post #488
more fish meal maybe?
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#488 5 Apr 2016 at 11.16am | | |
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In reply to Post #458
Could the Hydrolysied Poultry Protein be replaced with anything else!
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#487 23 Mar 2016 at 5.08pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Hi Guys I am from Slovakia
I would like to test the recipe and I would like to know whether Only HNV spring can I use coco milk as a sweetener,
or no. My question is It wil mustiness ??
200 g soya meal ,200 g maize meal, 200 g kasein , 100 g lactalbumin, 100 g fishmeal LT94, 200 g dry cocomilk, 15 ml cocooil, 15 ml Allamino nutric, 10 ml Bacterie septic, 5 ml coco flour 15 ml cocomilk 
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#486 21 Mar 2016 at 5.34pm | | |
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In reply to Post #485
Yeah I used it at 10% consistency of the mix the same as normal eggs but when I did a tank test they went really soft after 15 hours. That is fine for me as I made my hookbaits up with normal eggs plus I glug them in glycerine and the shellfish liquid which hardens them right up.
Also I boil them so they still have a soft centre to keep as much nutrition and pulling power as possible
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#485 21 Mar 2016 at 4.16pm | | |
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In reply to Post #484
They look good, ive never used the megablend red and have usually used the megablend sweet.
Did you use egg powder or eggs? and how did you find it?
I have found when using it at 10% in a similar but more soluble mix that it doesnt quite bind as well and the baits breakdown a little quicker than using eggs which is fine for most of my fishing, but if i up the level to nearer 15% it gives a bait with very similar breakdown to the one made with eggs
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#484 21 Mar 2016 at 11.20am | | |
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Made 110kgs of this over the last week. Looking awesome, can't wait to get out in France and haul on them.
Check out the speckles from the megabled red. (Photos a bit cack)
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#483 17 Mar 2016 at 3.56pm | | |
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Hi from Italy guys! Rolled a small batch yesterday,they are ready to be frozen and used through the weekend! I have already tested this bait with good results,but the one I made before were without equivite!
This one has 2,5% selenavite and 2,5% GLM.
As liquid part I used NHDC,Peach and OE black pepper.
16 mm baits steamed 5.45 minutes.
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#482 17 Mar 2016 at 3.43pm | | |
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In reply to Post #481
No they don't but click the link on the post bud
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#481 17 Mar 2016 at 3.04pm | | |
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In reply to Post #480
I saw that but CC Moore don't sell that either? I'm new to all this but fancy having a crack at it.
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#480 17 Mar 2016 at 2.29pm | | |
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In reply to Post #479
If you look at post 465 there is a link to selenavite E, which can be used instead of. I've just got home from fishing after trying my own mix.....lost 3 fish in the weed, but they do work great 
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#479 17 Mar 2016 at 2.04pm | | |
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Guys how important is the Equivite in the BM1? I'm putting an order together on the CC Moore website but can't find it. I want to try and buy all ingredients from the same place for now .
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#478 6 Mar 2016 at 10.54am | | |
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In reply to Post #458
Could you swap poultry protein for hydrolyzed feather meal pete? Is candy sweet a strong powdered sweetener in that recepie?
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#477 4 Mar 2016 at 10.16pm | | |
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Made my first batch of BM1 this morning..they came out great! I cant wait to get home from work to see how they have dried out !!
Thanks for the recipe and thanks for all the advice, looking forward to getting back to the rolling table...wife permitting!
Just another quick question I cant seem to find the Poultry protein meal for the BM2 anywhere on the CC Moore website, is this called something else? I apologise if it mentions this elsewhere in the thread but i havent seen it asked anywhere else
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#476 4 Mar 2016 at 9.23am | | |
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In reply to Post #475
Cheers guys
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#475 3 Mar 2016 at 6.27pm | | |
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In reply to Post #469
I dont use the bm1 mix but a similar mix along the same lines and i use the ratio you mention of one kilo of whole egg powder per 10kilo of base.
For roughly one 1.1 kilo of mix i use 100mil of my liquid additives to 1/2 pint of water, it may not be exactly the same for your mix but will give you a starting point to work from
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#474 3 Mar 2016 at 5.41pm | | |
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In reply to Post #469
Not used it with this mix but as a starting point I use 250g of egg powder to a litre of water. This works out at (very) roughly 3kg of base mix. Liquids then added to that.
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#473 3 Mar 2016 at 2.04pm | | |
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In reply to Post #472
yeah will take a drive as I live in the villages so lots of farms.....
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#472 3 Mar 2016 at 2.02pm | | |
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In reply to Post #471
Find your local farm shop and they will normally do a deal
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#471 3 Mar 2016 at 1.46pm | | |
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In reply to Post #470
LoL, my little 3 year old has just walked in and said WOW  That is a lot of bait! LOL
I don't think Tescos would sell me the amount of eggs I need 
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#470 3 Mar 2016 at 1.37pm | | |
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In reply to Post #469
Sorry no I have not used it, I always used fresh eggs from local farms. They used to love seeing me walking up the drive with my wheel barrow to take home 200-300 eggs at a time
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#469 3 Mar 2016 at 1.33pm | | |
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In reply to Post #466
One question mate. I have always used real eggs in my mix, but going to be using Whole Egg Powder instead this time.
I have been reading on here to start at 1kg per 10kg base mix, so that is what I was going to start with but wondered if you or anyone else has used Whole Egg Powder in the BM1 before and if so what quantities did you use it in, per KG base mix & also how much water added?
Much appreciated, saves wasting bait in a trial and error....
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#468 3 Mar 2016 at 1.30pm | | |
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In reply to Post #460
Just put an order in with CCMoores for a French trip that came today. First time I have bought in higher quantities, works out much cheaper :
This is what I ordered (in kgs)
lt94 25
maize protein 25
megablend 12.5
semolina 12.5
soya flour 12.5
pre digested fishmeal 12.5
vitamealo 10
betaine 1
liquid shellfish Concentrate 2 litres
salmon oil 5 litres
Whole Egg Powder 10
Total 371.4
With 7% discount 345.402
Delivery charge 41
Total Delivered 386.66
I already have the Selenavite and 7 of the items will make much more than the 80kgs dry mix the LT94 & Shellfish will make
Top Bait - TOP TOP Prize - and a big for a 1 stop shop in the name of CCMoores.
Just got to roll this lot now!
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#467 28 Feb 2016 at 1.20pm | | |
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In reply to Post #465
Thanks
All ordered up hopefully everything will be here by Friday
Just another question, I have some whey powder in my cupboard that won't get used, what could I substitute in the BM1 mix for this? Or is it even possible?
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#466 23 Feb 2016 at 9.43am | | |
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In reply to Post #465
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#465 22 Feb 2016 at 6.02pm | | |
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In reply to Post #464
Here you go Selenevite E, use at 2.5% and add something else you fancy to make up the other 2.5%. I used GLM powder on my latest batch.
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#464 22 Feb 2016 at 5.41pm | | |
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In reply to Post #460
yeah i suppose it would save on postage too!
Im sure it has been said on this thread but im unable to find it now....could something else be used as a substitute for Equivite? as its very expensive and CC Moore dont have it.
Cheers!
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#463 22 Feb 2016 at 5.09pm | | |
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In reply to Post #462
I just put an offer in on a new home so not very rich at all at the moment. 
Ill have a play with spirulina through the summer, as its an ingredient I've never used before and keep wanting to try it.
Thanks
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#462 22 Feb 2016 at 5.05pm | | |
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In reply to Post #461
I have used it in this bait at 2% and it made a difference (not as good if I left it out) BUT that's all I tried as I had little time to test like I used too. No idea as to a maximum, how rich are you feeling 
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#461 22 Feb 2016 at 4.59pm | | |
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In reply to Post #458
What is a good inclusion level in any bait for Spirulina in your opinion? Also what would you suggest is a maximum level for its inclusion?
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#460 22 Feb 2016 at 1.32pm | | |
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In reply to Post #459
I tend to only use CC Moore these days. Used to shop around and get bits and bobs from all over the place but time is short these days so stick with one supplier
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#459 22 Feb 2016 at 1.30pm | | |
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In reply to Post #458
Any recommendations of where I should order the ingredients.....CC Moore looks as good as any
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#458 22 Feb 2016 at 8.25am | | |
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In reply to Post #77
To answer a couple of questions this mix can be used all year without any worries, many have done and still do and it has stood the test of time
I have used it as a basis for many baits including sweet, savory, meaty and fishy 'flavours'.....but not all at once 
I only fish a few hours a year now, work, family and other hobbies get in the way. Last year I managed about 3 or 4 nights and that was twice as many as the year before! However every now and then I get the bait books out, scratch my head and come up with a new mix (I say new but they are always a tweak of an existing mix). If you take BM1 and tweak it then you may end up with this.
20% LT94
20% Vanilla Extract Meal
17.8% Megablend
8% Crunchy Kelp Meal
8% Pre-digested fishmeal
10% Semolina
4% Supergold 60
4% Blood plasma
4% Hydrolysied Poultry Protein
2% Spirulina
1% Selenavite E
1% Betaine
0.3% (yes 0.3%!) Candy Sweet
per 10 eggs, 50ml CSL and 5ml Karpi
This mix has out-fished any other bait I have tried it against on various waters from club to day ticket to private lakes. Unfortunately the Poultry protein is no longer available and I have run out of Karpi and I am not about to order another production batch at crica £100 a go....so that's the end of that mix 
Later this year I might see what i can do to the above mix and take it to the next level, but it was so good I am not sure it will be easy to tweak it again
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#457 21 Feb 2016 at 12.14pm | | |
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In reply to Post #454
Yeah, it smells quite fishy even with no flavour in it. 1ml per kilo of John Bakers crab flavour can really help improve this naturally built in smell if you wanted a fishy bait.
JB crab is expensive to buy, but at 1ml/kg it goes a long way, making up to 100kg for the price.
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#456 20 Feb 2016 at 6.41pm | | |
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In reply to Post #455
Great thanks you! I'm going to give these a go as my first attempt, now I'm going to order all the ingredients
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#455 20 Feb 2016 at 3.12pm | | |
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In reply to Post #454
I've used it with nothing but salmon oil and L030 and it's worked a treat, also used Squid and Octopus/Esterblend 12, also worked a treat. Basically just add any flavour you feel confident with. The basemix is quite distinct without adding anything and you have to add quite a bit of flavour to notice it really. I tend to add a small amount to the mixes then make some special hookbaits with more flavour and then put them in pots with a bit of glug.
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#454 20 Feb 2016 at 12.45pm | | |
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In reply to Post #453
Thanks for the info bud. Does the BM1 Mix smell of anything if no flavouring is added? I'm assuming it's going to smell fishy because of the fish meal base?
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#453 20 Feb 2016 at 11.48am | | |
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In reply to Post #452
Its an all year round mix IMO, and yes you can add any flavour you like to it if you wanted to put one in. I liked it when i used it on a lake with strawberry flavour believe it or not. I used other flavours in it depending on which lake i rolled it for, but it seemed to take fruit or savory flavours really well.
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#452 20 Feb 2016 at 9.49am | | |
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I'm thinking of trying the BM1 mix. I've never done it before and never even heard of half the ingredients. Are we able to use this mix in winter time? Also do we just add our own flavourings to the mix?
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#451 13 Feb 2016 at 4.56pm | | |
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Well I've just made a batch of BM1 and this time used CLO instead of Meggablend and all the stickiness problems I had last time had gone. In fact it rolled like a dream once I'd sorted out my liquid to basemix ratio. Whether it was just the change to CLO that made the difference I'm not sure as i got all my ingredients from a different source this time.
Just thought I'd mention it though as a few people were saying how sticky the mix was.
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#450 22 Jan 2016 at 11.19am | | |
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In reply to Post #449
If it ain't broke then why fix it ;-)
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#449 22 Jan 2016 at 8.36am | | |
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In reply to Post #448
Ha ha, I had a feeling you might still be using it Pete 
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#448 22 Jan 2016 at 8.03am | | |
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In reply to Post #447
I still use a version of it, had some great sessions using it last year and will be using it again this year
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#447 21 Jan 2016 at 6.41pm | | |
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In reply to Post #446
I'm hopefully going to have a bit more time this year for bait making, so am going to give the BM1 a go again as I had good results when I last used it. Is anyone else still using it?
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#446 8 Dec 2015 at 2.19pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
excellent thread! Looking forward to having a play with this.
Thanks to everyone contributing!
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#445 24 Nov 2015 at 7.56pm | | |
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In reply to Post #444
Yes it is cheaper, however the vitamealo/milk replacer offers binding and skinning properties, a creamy taste, some fats and a good oil content with some vitamins and minerals.
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#444 24 Nov 2015 at 10.09am | | |
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In reply to Post #443
Excellent thanks. I'm assuming Vitamelo is used to keep the cost down but WPC would be the preference if cost was not an issue?
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#443 23 Nov 2015 at 6.33pm | | |
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In reply to Post #442
nope.
WPC is a higher quality binding ( but still soluble ) milk powder with a lot less oil content than the vitamealo.
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#442 23 Nov 2015 at 6.25pm | | |
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Any harm in swapping out the Vitamealo in BM1 for WPC?
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#441 28 Sept 2015 at 11.57am | | |
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In reply to Post #440
I'm just wondering is any one using this mix still . Looking at using it , I usaly use a pre made Base mix but want a change.
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#440 7 Sept 2015 at 8.40pm | | |
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In reply to Post #439
its slightly higher than 20 % . the main solubles are the vitamilo and predigested but the casien is semi soluble ( cannt remember wether its 2 % or 20 % )
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#439 4 Sept 2015 at 8.06pm | | |
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In reply to Post #438
Thanks for putting that up, is that one 20% soluble
atb Paul
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#438 3 Sept 2015 at 10.41pm | | |
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In reply to Post #437
33% LT94 Fishmeal
18% Pre digested fishmeal
18% Sluis CLO
12% vitamelo
10% Acid casein
3% kelp
3% robin red
1.5% feedstim xp
1.5% Liver powder
10ml salmon oil
10ml shellfish & plumb
my take on your recipe is you have 30 % solubkes within the mix in my summer baits i aim for about 20 % but winter i up this to 25 ish %
33% LT94 Fishmeal
10% Pre digested fishmeal
18% haiths CLO
10% vitamelo
10% Acid casein
5% kelp
10% robin red
2% GLM
2% Liver powder
10ml cod liver oil (per 5 eggs )
3ml shellfish & plumb (again per 5 eggs. ive never used this flavour so im just guessing at the level)
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#437 3 Sept 2015 at 9.52pm | | |
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In reply to Post #436
How does this sound, it's quite close Nutrabaits big fish mix, it works out about £4.50 kilo of boilie plus eggs
33% LT94 Fishmeal
18% Pre digested fishmeal
18% Sluis CLO
12% vitamelo
10% Acid casein
3% kelp
3% robin red
1.5% feedstim xp
1.5% Liver powder
10ml salmon oil
10ml shellfish & plumb
many thanks Paul
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#436 2 Sept 2015 at 4.08pm | | |
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In reply to Post #435
CLO would be fine as would any of the Megablends
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#435 2 Sept 2015 at 1.31pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Thanks for a speedy reply
Do you know if the egg based bird food is the same as cc moores CLO
http://www.ccmoore.com/moores-clo-sluis-equivalent-p-557.html
or is that something different?
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#434 2 Sept 2015 at 12.27pm | | |
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In reply to Post #433
Full fat but make sure it is heat treated (I think most is but worth checking)
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#433 2 Sept 2015 at 11.39am | | |
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In reply to Post #77
should the soya flour be defatted or full fat?
Thanks
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#432 1 Sept 2015 at 2.21pm | | |
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In reply to Post #431
With the remaining 25g you could add kelp powder/seaweed meal or a little liver powder ( or both) to add more B vitamins and keep more built in attraction in the bait.
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#431 1 Sept 2015 at 10.41am | | |
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In reply to Post #429
Or find a source of Selenevite E and use at 25g per kilo leaving you 25g/kg to play around with
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#430 31 Aug 2015 at 0.42am | | |
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In reply to Post #419
Try AA Baits in Warrington Daniel
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#429 29 Aug 2015 at 12.55pm | | |
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In reply to Post #428
what they sell that is equivalent to Equivate
Nothing really. Just add the attractor of your choice. Concentrated yeast or CSL powder would be good choices if your after something to replace Equivite.
Or find a source of Selenevite E and use at 25g per kilo leaving you 25g/kg to play around with. Betaine and Garlic powder? 
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#428 28 Aug 2015 at 9.04pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
I'm gonna knock this mix up and source the ingredients from CC Moore, but can anyone tell me what they sell that is equivalent to Equivate
cheers Paul
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#427 28 Jun 2015 at 11.30pm | | |
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In reply to Post #426
Feedstim.com would be worth a look.
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#426 27 Jun 2015 at 8.10am | | |
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In reply to Post #423
were would i get dmpt from
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#425 5 Jun 2015 at 10.54pm | | |
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In reply to Post #424
Like this! Try pressing "reply"! 
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#424 5 Jun 2015 at 1.34pm | | |
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In reply to Post #142
How do I post on here
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#423 5 May 2015 at 1.26pm | | |
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In reply to Post #422
Thank you for your answer.
Dmpt is:
considered as the best feed lure, for both fresh water and sea water aquatic animals. In several lab- and field tests DMPT comes out as the best feed inducing stimulant ever tested. DMPT not only improves feed intake, but also acts as a water soluble hormone-like substance. DMPT is the most effective methyl donor available, it enhances the ability to cope with stress associated with catch / transportation of fish and other aquatic animals.
It is revert to as the fourth generation attractant for aquatic animals. In several studies it is showed that the attractant effect of DMPT is around 1.25 times better than choline chloride, 2.56 times betaine, 1.42 times methyl-methionine and 1.56 times better than glutamine.
Feed palatability is an important factor for fish growth rate, feed conversion, health status and water quality. Feed with good flavor will enhance feed intake, shorten eating time, reduce loss of nutrients and water pollution, and eventually improve efficiency of feed utilization.
High stability supports high temperatures during pellet feed processing. The melting point is about 121ËšC, therefore it can decrease the losses of nutrients in feeds during high temperature pellet, cooking or steaming processing. It is very hygroscopic, do not leave in open air.
This substance is silently being used by many bait companies.
Take a look at the reviews on the next tab.
Dosage direction, per kg dry mix:
Especially for use with aquatic animals including fish like common carp, koi carp, catfish, gold fish, shrimp, crab, terrapin etc.
In fish bait as an instant attractor, use up to a maximum of about 3 gr, in a long term bait use around 0.7 - 1.5 gr per kg dry mix.
With groundbait, stickmixes, particles, etc use up to around 1 - 3 gr per kg ready bait for creating a massive bait response.
Very good results can also be obtained adding this to your soak. In a soak use 0,3 -Â 1gr dmpt per kg bait.
DMPT can be used as an extra attractor alongside other additives. This is a very concentrated ingredient, using less is often better. If used too much the bait will not be eaten!
Because this powder has the tendency to clot it is best applied mixing it direct with your liquids in which it will dissolve completely to get an even spread, or smash it first with a spoon.
It costs about 3 £ for 25 gr
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#422 2 May 2015 at 8.37pm | | |
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In reply to Post #421
No idea what dpmt is but I would just stick to the Activator if I were you. 1 additive is enough.
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#421 1 May 2015 at 10.55am | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Can anyone tell me if it makes sense to use all of the following additives in 1 mix?
Butyric acid (5 gr / 1000gr)
Dmpt (2 gr / 1000gr)
Mainline activator (15ml / 1000gr)
They seem to be great additives in any mix, but i was wondering if the activator doesnt cover the other 2 ?
since they are very strong, i dont want to over-do it...
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#420 4 Apr 2015 at 1.27pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
just been to kingsley mill in cheshire they didnt have any of the ingredients for bm1 any ideas were i can get them from in cheshire
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#419 4 Apr 2015 at 10.09am | | |
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In reply to Post #418
were do people get there flavours and additives from after a quick look they seem to make your homemade boilies quite a bit more expensive
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#418 21 Mar 2015 at 9.08pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
What powdered additives have people used in this mix
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#417 21 Mar 2015 at 2.20pm | | |
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In reply to Post #415
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#416 5 Mar 2015 at 11.56pm | | |
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In reply to Post #409
did you "oil the table"ie put a little hemp oil or such like on a rag and wipe the the grooves with it?something I read in I think mark mckennas article
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#415 28 Feb 2015 at 3.30am | | |
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In reply to Post #413
Get a kilo of semolina and mix it with a kilo of Nectarblend, Red factor or EMP, and roll that with eggs. 2 ingredients. Hows that?
And you'll catch loads with it too.
If you wanted really simple, leave out the semo, and roll the other half on its own. Don't get much simpler than that.
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#414 27 Feb 2015 at 7.47pm | | |
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#413 27 Feb 2015 at 5.44pm | | |
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In reply to Post #412
Has anyone got any uncomplicated boilie recipies using ingredients that i can get either from a supermarket or animal feed store ?
I'm going to be looking at making a few of my own this year for the first time and im getting weighed down with complicated recipies.
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#412 27 Feb 2015 at 1.14pm | | |
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In reply to Post #411
Yes you could do. Change it for anything you like really. Sardine and Anchovy is my favourite fish meal too.
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#411 26 Feb 2015 at 10.53am | | |
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In reply to Post #77
On the second mix would it be suitable to change the poultry meal for sardine and anchovy??
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#410 23 Feb 2015 at 4.24pm | | |
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#409 11 Jan 2015 at 8.27pm | | |
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I mixed up this base mix today and found the mix very sticky, sticking to the rolling table a lot
I tried leaving the mix for 10 20 and 30 minutes before rolling it was either to sticky or to dry that the gunned out sausages fell to bits when I tried putting them on the rolling table, any help would be great?
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#408 27 Oct 2014 at 11.07pm | | |
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Message Suppressed by Forum Moderator.
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#407 8 Oct 2014 at 0.00am | | |
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In reply to Post #406
Think I see what you mean. The additives all do slightly different things within the bait. To be honest if the base is good like the recipe above then you shouldn't need to add much. I tend to add 1 powder attractor like nash squid extract or robin red, krill etc, a bulk liquid food (molasses and anchovy sauce being two of my favourites) and a flavour/sweetener. The cajousers are good and sweeten/flavour the bait at the same time.
For example: 500g base mix +7.5g of squid powder+25mil of anchovy sauce+2.5mil of sweet cajouser and 12 drops black pepper oil.
No reason why you cant mix fishy with cream or fruit flavours.
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#406 7 Oct 2014 at 10.29pm | | |
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In reply to Post #405
Cheers smirker, I'll take a look for that, I guess what I'm looking for are the reasons behind the different additives as there are similar flavours in different styles.
ie. cajousers,elites, oils
Do you need to add the other ingredients like liquid foods or natural attractors and what are there purpose are they required ?
Really just to get a handle on it to give me confidence when I make it.
Like I say I know a lot of its trial and error to which I'm perpared to do.
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#405 7 Oct 2014 at 2.28pm | | |
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In reply to Post #404
Jay Riders E-books on his site (books on carp) well worth a look. Cheaper than buying a hard copy. What do you want to know exactly? Inclusion levels of attractors are on the bottles?
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#404 6 Oct 2014 at 4.56pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Do any of you experienced home made boillie makers know of any decent books on the subject ?
I have used nutrabaits base mixes to some success but now I have more time I would like to start experimenting a bit more, what I find most difficult is knowing what size quantities I need to be using of the various oils, cajousers, and elites, none of this info seems that available other than a few recipes on various portals to which I don't want to do the same as.
I know a lot of this is trial and error which I accept but being in the same ball park would be handy.
cheers for any help
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#403 31 Aug 2014 at 11.06am | | |
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Does anyone know where to get poultry protein meal from? Can't find it on aa baits website.
Could it be replaced with something else?
I've found a meat a bone meal which has 44% protein and 13% oil
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#402 13 Jun 2014 at 3.47pm | | |
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In reply to Post #401
Yes. BM1 can be rolled for about £4 per including eggs etc if you shop around. Maybe less.
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#401 12 Jun 2014 at 8.14pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
Have you found that it is overall cheaper to make yourself 10kg of boils rather than buying from a company? Thoughts?
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#400 19 May 2014 at 0.17am | | |
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In reply to Post #77
If you are having trouble with the bm1 being too soft for your particular application, I would recommend swapping the soya flour for rice flour or maize flour. This made the necessary difference in a basemix I have used for quite a few years to good effect. 2-3% blood powder seriously firms up the bait (I would think whey gel or blood plasma is comparable). Another simple trick is to sieve the mix for the hookbaits and boil those 30 secs longer than normal. Usually makes them a bit firmer for bit longer.
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#399 20 Mar 2014 at 8.31am | | |
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In reply to Post #397
300g LT94 fishmeal
150g Maize Protein Meal 60% (supergold 60)
130g Egg based bird food like CeDe
100g Semolina
100g Soya flour (heat treated)
85g pre-digested fishmeal
85g Calf or lambs milk powder such as Vitamelo
25g selenavite e
10g GLM powder
CSL 50ml
CLO 25ml
8-9 eggs
does that about right?
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#398 20 Mar 2014 at 8.24am | | |
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In reply to Post #395
like i said this is great help, and thanks for the discount code mate
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#397 20 Mar 2014 at 8.22am | | |
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In reply to Post #396
so do 25g of GLM powder
how much CSL liquid should i put in?
and same with cod liver oil how much should i put in
with glm it depends on the depth of your pocket but i generally use 10 gms per kg
when i have used CSL i use it at 50 ml per kg
CLO i use at between 20 and 30 ml per kg
and.. would you suggest using flavoring or leave it with out?
peach and black pepper is a time honoured flavour combo
cranberry
tutti frutti
salmon
caviar
salmon / caviar
cranberry/ caviar
strawberry
cream
maple
the only flavours i use these days are nutrabaits and when it comes to flavour combos the worlds your oyster what ever flavour you go with stick with it . Its no good making a batch of bait 1 week with say strawberry and then next week make a batch with tutti
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#396 20 Mar 2014 at 8.17am | | |
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In reply to Post #393
so do 25g of GLM powder
how much CSL liquid should i put in?
and same with cod liver oil how much should i put in?
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#395 20 Mar 2014 at 0.27am | | |
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In reply to Post #392
You can get Selenavite E from VetUK and if you use this code ORDER10 you get 10% off your first order.
They are the cheapest I have found.
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#394 19 Mar 2014 at 11.44pm | | |
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#393 19 Mar 2014 at 11.35pm | | |
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In reply to Post #392
Lars28 links to some places to buy selenavite e in post 161. To be honest I've not brought any in a while. You may be able to get it cheaper if you shop around now.
I would use GLM or garlic powder and betaine or csl powder. I would also include CSL liquid, and some cod liver oil.
As for flavours, you could use any you fancy. Even some flavours you may not think about will go in this recipe. Try some of the Elites from Nutrabaits. If you don't fancy experimenting with flavours on this base mix, just choose a good fishy one, or even an essential oil. Orange oil or Clove being two of my favourites.
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#392 19 Mar 2014 at 11.06pm | | |
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In reply to Post #391
cheers mate, really appreciate the help.
Just a few more questions and ill be on my way
what bait additive would you suggest??
The water i'm fishing get really weedy in the winter, and they love maize!
Also where can i get selenavite e from??
and.. would you suggest using flavoring or leave it with out?
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#391 19 Mar 2014 at 5.22pm | | |
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In reply to Post #390
Use selenavite e at 25g per kilo. this will leave you 25g for an additive of your choice.
300g LT94 fishmeal
150g Maize Protein Meal 60% (supergold 60)
130g Egg based bird food like CeDe
100g Semolina
100g Soya flour (heat treated)
85g pre-digested fishmeal
85g Calf or lambs milk powder such as Vitamelo
25g selenavite e
25g additive of your choice.
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#390 18 Mar 2014 at 10.58pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
hi, what is smurfs mix in grams to make 1kg??
BM1 (basic HNV mix)
30% LT94 fishmeal
15% Maize Protein Meal 60% (supergold 60)
13% Egg based bird food like CeDe
10% Semolina
10% Soya flour (heat treated)
8.5% pre-digested fishmeal
8.5% Calf or lambs milk powder such as Vitamelo
5% Equivite
Also should i use Equivite or Selenavite??
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#389 17 Mar 2014 at 10.05am | | |
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In reply to Post #387
Supergold 60 is maize protein. If you scroll through this thread you will find a mix I have posted. Try that as it rolls a dream and very nutritious etc. It is a fish meal but will blend with a fruit flavour such as Essential baits shellfish plum and fruit factor 6 combo. If you decide to include per digested then whatever weight you include then remove that weight from the lt94.
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#387 16 Mar 2014 at 12.39pm | | |
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In reply to Post #386
Hi mate,
Ok + would I have to replace anything to add in Pre-digested?
The lake I'm fishing they love maize!
I'm not too sure what the best base mix would be but they love yellow/white and maize sweet things (pineapple ect.) ! Do you have any suggestions for a good base mix?
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#386 16 Mar 2014 at 8.25am | | |
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In reply to Post #385
No need for maize flour and supergold 60. Just use supergold 60 for the whole weight of the two combined. Not sure about the pepper. Have you thought about Robin Red or combining some soluble pre-digested fishmeal?
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#385 8 Mar 2014 at 9.06pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
hi people im new to bollie making and want to make my own base mix!
here is what i have come up with-
125grms milk powder
125grms maize flour
125grms soya flour
125grms semolina
200grms mega blend or supergold 60
250grms lt94
80grms seaweed & kelp powder
7 1/2 ml salmon flavour
1/2 tea spoon sea salt
1/2 tea spoon crushed black pepper
8/9 eggs depending on size
Boil for 90 seconds to 2 mins
what do you guys think? any tip??
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#384 17 Feb 2014 at 7.17pm | | |
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In reply to Post #383
Fair point mate. Although the level maybe a little on the low side I am trying to make a long term bait for a campaign on a new water that I started in January. I was hoping that even low levels would increase attraction and the 'want it' factor due to the overall effectiveness of the inclusion of GLM. Increased nutrient profile etc.
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#383 15 Feb 2014 at 9.48pm | | |
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In reply to Post #382
too little to come to the fore.I'd rather put 2% squid nash.
or I would put 5-10%glm but only in hookbaits.
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#382 14 Feb 2014 at 11.39am | | |
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In reply to Post #381
Thanks for the reply. Why do you think glm for hookbaits only mate? Cost? Rollability?
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#381 13 Feb 2014 at 9.11am | | |
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In reply to Post #380
my opinion
30% LT94
13% Supergold 60
15% Megablend
10% Semolina
10% Soya
6% Vitamelo
5% Krill meal
5% Robin red
6% predigest
put glm at higher doses only in hookbaits,make powdered dip...
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#380 11 Feb 2014 at 4.00pm | | |
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In reply to Post #379
I know Ken said that there is no need to tweak but can't help myself lol!!! Opinions please....
30% LT94
13% Supergold 60
15% Megablend
10% Semolina
10% Soya
8.5% Vitamelo
5% Krill meal
5% Robin red
3.5% GLM
Think it will roll ok? Will be making a hard version with albumin etc for hook baits.
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#379 26 Jan 2014 at 11.31pm | | |
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hi all new to forum and bait rolling would like to know if this mix will roll any feed back will be well appreciated cheers all
200g megga blend
200g semolina
100g soya flour
100g whey protein concentrate
75g vitamaelo
125g egg albumen
200g tiger nut flour
2ml talin
5ml hazelnut essence
30ml liquid tiger nut
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| | | Karlos | | Posts: 12660 |  | | [ MODERATOR ] | |
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#378 8 Sept 2013 at 2.47pm | | |
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In reply to Post #377
Whey is water soluble, so will soften up.
Depends what quality of Whey you get, some is more soluble than others
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#377 8 Sept 2013 at 1.46pm | | |
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In reply to Post #376
Seeing as I am only talking hookbaits maybe that's what I should do also. The albumin/whey seems to make the baits harder yes, but it doesn't seem to stop them going soft once in the water.
I am ashamed to say it but I had to resort to using some readymades on the hair over the weekend so they were still there in the morning!
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#376 7 Sept 2013 at 4.15pm | | |
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In reply to Post #375
large volumes of semolina!..
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#375 7 Sept 2013 at 3.10pm | | |
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In reply to Post #374
Out of interest, is that what the commercial bait companies use?
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#374 7 Sept 2013 at 8.47am | | |
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In reply to Post #373
I am still having a problem with harder hookbaits
equal amounts of whey gel and egg albumin should firm them up abit more i would start at maybe 5% of each
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#373 7 Sept 2013 at 8.25am | | |
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In reply to Post #368
I am still having a problem with harder hookbaits. I have made some up with 5% and 10% Whey Gel and they are like bullets. The only problem is that once in the water they are still softening up too quickly for my liking and am never confident that the bait is still there in the morning.
Is there anything else I can try as it is only the hookbaits I'm having a problem with?
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#372 4 Sept 2013 at 3.58pm | | |
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In reply to Post #371
No not really mate. Just stick to the BM1 or 2 and you'll be onto a winner.
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#371 3 Sept 2013 at 11.51pm | | |
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I have seen some recipes about I was wondering if dog kibble and chilli flakes would work as a boilie.
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#370 12 Aug 2013 at 8.55am | | |
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In reply to Post #369
Sorry all my stuff is HNV and to me a birdfood bait will never be HNV so I din't ever make any
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#369 11 Aug 2013 at 11.12am | | |
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In reply to Post #368
cheers smurf will do! its a great mix, easy to roll and when you delve into the FLAA side, its better than 90% than some of the bait being sold out there!! my fishing buddy is using a bait made by one of the most popular who sell for £5-6 per kilo, and makes for untold online bait companies, when we compared , his had hardly any birdfood in it, very oily and seemed to be mainly semo, not being a bait buff im not sure 100% but the BM 1 looked so much better!!
As of interest, did you have any birdfoody type recipies to share? would love to tinker about with one of those too!
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#368 10 Aug 2013 at 11.15pm | | |
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In reply to Post #367
Try making some harder hookbaits with blood plasma, wpc or whey gel. 5% of any one of these will make them harder :-)
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#367 10 Aug 2013 at 6.58pm | | |
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In reply to Post #366
cheers nellie, one thing i have found , i made a batch before which was great , but adding seaweed really brings out a fishy salty taste that is tops! its a very coarse mix which i love and i added only a half a ml of monster crab and half a mil of cranberry per egg, so 6 ml per 6 eggs. no sweetener. could i harden the bait slighlty by reducing the clo and adding semo ?
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#366 10 Aug 2013 at 4.58pm | | |
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In reply to Post #365
Could eat the myself mate.
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#365 10 Aug 2013 at 4.36pm | | |
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Message Suppressed by Forum Moderator.
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#364 15 Jul 2013 at 4.44pm | | |
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In reply to Post #363
I've been reading this thread with interest, and it has got my mind racing with combinations and levels.
Peter(Smurf) deserves a commission from the ingredient suppliers, and from the rest of us for abusing his kind gesture!
I have been battling (albeit on paper), with some of the variations to BM1 listed in this thread. Specifically the inclusion of both GLME and betaine.
Can anyone clarify if additional betaine levels should be lowered/omitted altogether, given the levels that GLME already contains?
Would say 50g GLME provide enough betaine to negate its inclusion separately?
Perhaps adding a half dose of betaine to the hookbaits for added atttraction?
Obviously, I am trying to avoid the repellent effects that too much betaine can cause.
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#363 26 Jun 2013 at 8.25am | | |
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In reply to Post #361
Yes you can take the Poultry protein out and either adjust the other ingredients or like you say a 50/50 mix of fishmeal and bird food could work.
I never carried on with the development of the BM2, it was always an experiment to move away from fishmeal for commercial reasons....but the bait I make now I guess you could call the BM5 (3 and 4 soon got replaced in my bait own recipe book!) but only me and a couple of mates use it and it works very well
Having said that my BM5 is not that different to BM1....just tweaked here and there plus two other key ingredients I wanted to try
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#362 25 Jun 2013 at 10.57pm | | |
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In reply to Post #361
i too dont like using the poulty meal, ive used it in the past, but when it comes down to it I just like fishy baits not meaty baits o its a confidence thing with me.
I don't want to turn up on this thread and turn it into a bait company war, however just to add in response to AA baits I may look there but CCMoores have a loyalty scheme too even with the first order over £100 it goes to 5% off and goes up the more you spend plus freebies thrown in here and there so I personally may be swayed to look elsewhere but if it aint broke and all that
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#361 25 Jun 2013 at 10.00pm | | |
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In reply to Post #360
Ill have a good trawl through that website later. Thanks. With regards BM2 could the poulty protein be swapped for something esle? As to be honest ive used it before and hate the stuff. Maybe split the 220g 50/50 between another fish meal and a birdfood?
Also while your here why do you think everyone is all about the BM1? Also any idea if there will be a trilogy or quadrilogy to the BM saga? 
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#360 25 Jun 2013 at 9.40pm | | |
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In reply to Post #359
I used to get both from charnwood milling. My local farm feed shop used to order bags from them as it worked out cheaper than buying direct
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#359 25 Jun 2013 at 9.29pm | | |
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Has any one got any links to a supply of micronized crushed hemp and soya meal for BM2 or is everyone on BM1?
Or any alternatives to the above?
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#358 25 Jun 2013 at 7.41pm | | |
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In reply to Post #352
Also if you bought the products from AA baits you would probably save around a further £10-15
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#357 25 Jun 2013 at 1.49pm | | |
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In reply to Post #356
nice one cheers Peter.
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#356 25 Jun 2013 at 1.34pm | | |
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In reply to Post #355
I used to get 1.3-1.4x the basemix weight of mixes like BM1
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#355 25 Jun 2013 at 11.10am | | |
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In reply to Post #354
i worked it out at 1ml of liquid is 1 gram is that not correct then?
the weight of water is 1ml per gram....
and no i didnt take air drying into consideration suppose to get the exact cost I should weigh 1 mix after they have dried to my liking ....
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#354 25 Jun 2013 at 10.10am | | |
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In reply to Post #353
you will be lucky to get 1.5kg of boilies from 1kg of base mix. The liquid weight in normally approx 0.2kg to 0.35kg depending on liquids used.
Depending on air dry time (shelf life vs freezer) i multi ply by 1.2 or 1.25 this should also cover you for a little wastage and spillage
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#353 25 Jun 2013 at 1.10am | | |
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In reply to Post #352
ive just noticed the copy/paste in my table..... I used Vitamelo
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#352 25 Jun 2013 at 1.07am | | |
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I have put my mix into a table and carried out some basic calculations for anyone that is interested in a rough cost of the BM1 + a basic additives.
Price per kg mix including eggs & liquids = £5.51
5.51/ 1.5 (finished bait) £3.67
If you replace the ingredients in larger quantities when they run out the cost of the bait will come down, just in case you dont know how to do this, you can use the following equation.
Ingredient cost / ingredient amount(in grams) x amount per kg base mix
As I am just starting to make my own bait again (after relocating all my stuff to the shed after a few years break from stinking out the spare room) I have to get going on a minimum budget, so will be buying the ingredients all from CC Moores in quantities listed with the exception of Selenavite - that will at least get 11kgs of finished bait from the initial outlay, which is £118.24.
Each ingredient for me will then be topped up with 1 scale up of the quantity, i.e 5kgs will be 25kgs, 1kg will be 5kgs etc..
This will bring down the cost massively, for example just on LT94 in a 25kg sack will reduce the cost from 95p per kg to 65p , I have not worked it out yet, but no doubt you can bring it down to under £2.50 per kg of finished bait
Hope that helps people that have not started to make boilies before on how to calculate the costs
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#350 12 May 2013 at 10.15am | | |
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In reply to Post #347
I have used megablend sweet in this mix without flavour but I did use a drop of toasted Sesame oil which worked well
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#349 12 May 2013 at 0.01am | | |
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In reply to Post #348
Thanks very much, and for the tip
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#348 11 May 2013 at 11.47pm | | |
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In reply to Post #347
Yeah the megablends work fine. I use the red, one thing i will say is that because its quite course i would advise grinding it and the super gold down in a blender as it can cause the bait to break up to easily.
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#347 11 May 2013 at 11.37pm | | |
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Would any of the Meggablends be ok in BM1? CCMoores have the normal, red and sweet. I was thinking of going along the lines of a mild plum & scopex flavour and thought that the sweet Meggablend might compliment it well?
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#346 11 May 2013 at 9.29pm | | |
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In reply to Post #345
the only downside of the smurf's recipe is that if you don't use any oil, it's very sticky when you roll it, you need to let it dry a little during 15 to 30 min. before rolling it .
You're not wrong
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#345 11 May 2013 at 8.09pm | | |
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In reply to Post #344
maize gluten meal is a very dense ingrediant and at 15% it make the bait a good way to sink at the bottom
this recipe won't float and will be eaten by fish
also 17% of soluble ingrediant is not high ! i have also used 20% milk replacer with 10% pre-digested fishmeal and if you balance the recipe, it's not too sticky at the rolling stage and stay on hair for long enough .
the only downside of the smurf's recipe is that if you don't use any oil, it's very sticky when you roll it, you need to let it dry a little during 15 to 30 min. before rolling it .
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#344 11 May 2013 at 11.37am | | |
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In reply to Post #343
The well respected bait maker I'm referring to make some of the best baits available at the moment and always received rave reviews on this very forum for producing quality baits and providing outstanding service.
I was surprised as you at their comments.
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#343 11 May 2013 at 9.19am | | |
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In reply to Post #339
spoke to a very well respected custom bait roller recently about BM 1. They seemed to think that the solubles were too high and that the bait would float. I mentioned my dismay at their findings and also that the recipe was a long standing one from another well respected (no names were mentioned) bait maker. They didn't reply to that bit but did suggest something lower in solubles.
Thoughts?
that well respected bait maker aint got a clue then, cos 8.5% milk and 8.5% pre digested wont float anything
ive used 15% milks and 10% pre dig along with shrimp and krill and it sank ok.
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#342 11 May 2013 at 9.19am | | |
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In reply to Post #341
Oh yes, don't get me wrong, I have every faith in this recipe and it's designer. But it's just interesting how opinions differ.
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#341 11 May 2013 at 9.11am | | |
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In reply to Post #339
Well, I can tell you it definitely doesn't float but it definitely works, top quality bait
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#340 11 May 2013 at 8.59am | | |
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In reply to Post #337
You never give up, do you. Take a rest for a while... 
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#339 11 May 2013 at 8.37am | | |
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In reply to Post #338
I spoke to a very well respected custom bait roller recently about BM 1. They seemed to think that the solubles were too high and that the bait would float. I mentioned my dismay at their findings and also that the recipe was a long standing one from another well respected (no names were mentioned) bait maker. They didn't reply to that bit but did suggest something lower in solubles.
Thoughts?
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#338 11 May 2013 at 8.29am | | |
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In reply to Post #337
Give it a go nick, never used the krill but the other bits have worked well in that mix at similar levels :-)
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| | | bud | | Posts: 1022 |  | |
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#337 10 May 2013 at 4.25pm | | |
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Message Suppressed by Forum Moderator.
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#336 2 Apr 2013 at 5.32pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
I'm looking to kick off my bait making by using the bs1 mix after reading this thread (which has been bloody useful). Just wondering if anyone else has made a batch? If so, what sort of flavours (if any) have you added? Cheers
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#335 12 Mar 2013 at 8.59am | | |
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In reply to Post #334
Taking out your semolina and replacing it with 20% predigested fm I would not recommend. Your taking out your bulk binder and replacing it with a high level soluble ingredient. Even with the other binders in your mix this wont last long in the water.
If you want to make a good fish meal bait I would completely scrap your mix and start off with smurfs recipe!
If you want a fish meal bait but don't want to scrap your other base mix why not fish with bm1 along side your birdynut mix you have?
P.s. STOP SHOUTING!
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#334 11 Mar 2013 at 9.29pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
HELLO AL THIS IS A BASE MIX I'M USING MY SELF WHAT CAN I TAKE OUT TO MAKE IT A FISH MEAL I WAS THINKIN OF TAKING AL THE SEMOLINA OUT AND PUTIN IN PRE DIGESTED FISH MEAL INSTEAD
THIS IS A 1KG MIX
150G MEGABLEND
100G PEANUT FLOUR
205 MORES CLO
50G VITAMELO MILK POWDER
200G SELMOLINA
100G WHOLEEGG POWDER
100G VINILLA MEAL
100G SUPER GOLD 60
I LOOK FORWORD TO READING YOUR MESSAGES ND MENY THANKS FOR YOUR FEED BACK
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#333 11 Jan 2013 at 2.56pm | | |
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In reply to Post #332
Absolutely agree, its how it performs that matters, and that's another reason I am not a fan!
My point is that imo it is pointless balancing your amino level with prairie meal as I believe that a lot of those aminos will not be assimilated by the carp. That's just what I think, you obviously think that most of the aminos are usable and that's fine by me.
We will have to agree to disagree! But thanks for the chat
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#332 11 Jan 2013 at 1.49pm | | |
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In reply to Post #330
I am not disputing that, I am just saying it will never be as good as a high quality fishmeal or similar!
Unsure why people have such a hard time understanding that
i understand really well what you mean Sam. For you, corn gluten meal will never be as good as a high quality fishmeal or milk protein etc... and i agree ! when it's used alone ...
in this thread, we talk about it combined with fishmeal and both together give a good AA profile, and give a cheaper finished bait, so why using more expensive stuff ? because they are better ?
technical values on a paper are great, but i'm more convinced by my result on the bank and my own experience have proved me that it is not always the most expensive bait or ingrediant that work better
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#331 11 Jan 2013 at 11.21am | | |
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In reply to Post #330
i dont have a hard time-i looked at the bio value of prarie meal against fishmeal years ago-theyres no contest, but as some have mentioned-added with a few other ingredients-amino acid balance up.
then again so does poultry meal-and thats papp imo also .
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#330 11 Jan 2013 at 11.11am | | |
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In reply to Post #329
I am not disputing that, I am just saying it will never be as good as a high quality fishmeal or similar!
Unsure why people have such a hard time understanding that
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#329 11 Jan 2013 at 11.04am | | |
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In reply to Post #328
There could be several reasons its used in aquaculture feeds, it doesn't mean its the best product going
yes and thats essentially as a replacement for the ever increasing cost of fishmeal, prarie meal is a damn sight cheaper !
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#328 10 Jan 2013 at 7.30pm | | |
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In reply to Post #327
That is neither here nor there, I am not saying they will not benefit from it, I am saying that in my strong opinion it is not the best product to cover the amino requirements.
The whole point I was trying to make earlier is that I would rather spend extra on the best ingredients. Thats just me, nothing wrong with doing it another way. Smurf put this mix together as a wallet friendly mix I believe, I am sure he will agree that prairie meal is not the best source of protein for carp, having said that maybe he wont agree, Im not sure!
All I know is that it is certainly not for me, not for use of covering aminos anyway. It does have its uses though.
There could be several reasons its used in aquaculture feeds, it doesn't mean its the best product going
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#327 10 Jan 2013 at 12.07pm | | |
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In reply to Post #326
Sam, it's not me that i think 90% of it is available, it's a couple of studies i have read that say it is !!!
yes carp don't have stomach, but it as been found that they can digest the same source of protein as pike or salmonids (that have stomach) and benefit from it .
more than one studies have stated that, it's not new ! why soybean meal or corn gluten meal is used in a lot of commercial pellets for Koï ? if they were less digestible, or the koï will not benefit from those protein source like fishmeal, i think most of the producer will let this meal for ruminant or other food sector and will continue with full of fishmeal pellet.
let see this link: corn gluten meal: 96% digeastible nitrogen for salmonids, i think for carp is not far from that !
http://www.feedipedia.org/node/12288
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#326 10 Jan 2013 at 9.00am | | |
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In reply to Post #325
You think 90% of it is biologically available????
Why do you think that? The stated 90% is based on animals with complex acidic stomachs, not a simple alkaline tract that is found in carp!
Carp are not equipped to deal with such a source of protein with any efficiency.
Just because it is used in aqua culture feeds does not mean it has a high BV
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#325 10 Jan 2013 at 8.50am | | |
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In reply to Post #315
OK what I meant was I would rather get my protein content from high BV ingredients apposed to things like soya flour and supergold 60.
Supergold 60/ prairie meal is supposed to have a high bv, and maybe it has for cattle etc, but for carp?
Sam, have you ever search after the nutritionnal data of Maize Gluten meal, i don't think ...
it is not a well balanced protein alone, but if you put it with a bit of fishmeal, you will have a very good AA profile.
the fact are that the AA digestibility of maize gluten in fish is high for all AA: from 90 to 94% digestibility ! not a poor biological value ingrediant in my opignion ...
it's used a lot in aquaculture as part of a fishmeal replacer, aquaculture need to grow fish fast and well, so if maize gluten was so poor, it will not be used, result proved that replacing a part of the fishmeal content with maize gluten ended up with the same result on the grow and health of fish.
it's high in methionine, that is often the limiting amino in many mixes.
maize gluten is also really cheap (here in france) compared to fishmeal, so using it can cut the cost down of our bait
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#324 5 Jan 2013 at 9.23pm | | |
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In reply to Post #322
See post #108 onwards, I drove myself (and everyone else) bonkers with the same question 
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#323 5 Jan 2013 at 8.30pm | | |
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In reply to Post #322
Why not make that decision yourself and that way you would have had atleast some input into the mix
Best of luck either way
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#322 5 Jan 2013 at 8.07pm | | |
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In reply to Post #320
cheers for that . but would that leave me minus 2'5 per cent so if that's the case what could I up the missing . 25 per cent on
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#321 5 Jan 2013 at 2.53pm | | |
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In reply to Post #320
Would the real Ken Townley please stand up....
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#320 5 Jan 2013 at 2.48pm | | |
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In reply to Post #319
I know I am not Ken but 2.5% selenavite e is ideal
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#319 5 Jan 2013 at 2.20pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
afternoon ken
i was just wondering on the bm1 can i change the equivite for selenavite e if i can would it still be at 5%
cheers kevin
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#318 1 Jan 2013 at 6.08pm | | |
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In reply to Post #317
Out of interest what liquids did you add?
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#317 1 Jan 2013 at 3.46pm | | |
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In reply to Post #77
made my first batch of the said recipe today, cost me £2.66 kg including eggs and flavours, bought 100kg of dry ingrediants, cheap as chips bring on the spring
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#316 18 Dec 2012 at 10.33pm | | |
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In reply to Post #315
Thanks Sam......tells me just what I needed to know
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#315 18 Dec 2012 at 9.56pm | | |
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In reply to Post #314
OK what I meant was I would rather get my protein content from high BV ingredients apposed to things like soya flour and supergold 60.
Supergold 60/ prairie meal is supposed to have a high bv, and maybe it has for cattle etc, but for carp? I just don't agree with it.
I would rather balance aa profile with things such as higher levels of cpsp90, krill, wpc80, other refined milks, spirulina, high grade liver powder etc etc. No doubt someone will claim that refined milks are not digestible but it is my opinion that they are.
Just my opinion of coarse
You originally said- .....I'm asking for an example of the type of ingredients
But you then said you weren't asking for the ingredients
You also said- I'm not asking you to post up details of your mixes
I am confused but maybe that's the festive drinks! Hopefully I have told you all you needed to know
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#314 18 Dec 2012 at 9.43pm | | |
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In reply to Post #313
Don't be so defensive Sam - Im sure nobody thinks you are knocking Peter's mix. I understand what biological value is thanks so can give google a miss on that.
I'm not asking what ingredients have a high biological value. You said in your earlier post that you would prefer a bait with lower crude protein levels but a higher biological value..... I'm simply asking you for an example of such a bait, as it's your stated preference.....can you give one?
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#313 18 Dec 2012 at 9.13pm | | |
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In reply to Post #312
Should have known I was opening up myself for this!
I certainly did not critisise smurf or his mix, think I made that clear and praised him for posting it up.
Are you asking what ingredients have high biological value? Do a search!
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#312 18 Dec 2012 at 9.06pm | | |
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To be fair on Sam, it is much easier to criticise others efforts than it is to open yourself up for the same criticism
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#311 18 Dec 2012 at 7.30pm | | |
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In reply to Post #310
And if you read my post Sam I'm not asking you to post up details of your mixes.....I'm asking for an example of the type of ingredients/mix you describe.....doesn't have to be one of your secret mixes
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#310 18 Dec 2012 at 4.40pm | | |
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In reply to Post #308
If you re read my post, you will see that I am not willing to post any of my mixes up.
Why should I? I have worked hard to get the mixes how I want them, why shouldn't others?
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#309 18 Dec 2012 at 4.39pm | | |
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In reply to Post #307
You are not rubbing me up the wrong way at all Just felt your post deserved a response
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#308 18 Dec 2012 at 4.32pm | | |
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In reply to Post #307
I would favour a lower protein bait that has high BV where non of the protein is wasted and amply meets the carps aa requirement. Such a mix would obviously cost more money
Give us an example Sam
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#307 17 Dec 2012 at 5.08pm | | |
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In reply to Post #306
Hi Smurf
I have a terrible habit of rubbing people up the wrong way, so I shall tread very carefully with this one!
That is what I meant to say, this is a cheapER mix, I should have said (I was basically saying I am sure you can come up with better)
It is high protein and yes not all of it is available- not quite what I would go for in winter.
Imo in winter it is even more important to not drain the carps system and to get it bob on.
I would favour a lower protein bait that has high BV where non of the protein is wasted and amply meets the carps aa requirement. Such a mix would obviously cost more money
It is very good of you to put a mix up, so please don't think I am slating you.
Would I put a lower protein/ high bv mix up? NO! So I guess that is all I have to say!
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#306 17 Dec 2012 at 4.45pm | | |
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In reply to Post #305
Not been carping since the summer so I will answer this from my armchair
the protein content as it is very high in this mix, far too high imo especially considering the amino requirements are not quite met.
I don't quite get this statement....are you sure that says what you meant it to say?
As to 50% crude protein being high...If you take into account the limiting amino acids and if we assume that 80% of the crude protein is digestible (a figure I have used as an 'average', not based on hard facts for this mix) then we have a digestible content of circa 30-35% protein Thats a very good basis for an HNV bait to me
The BM1 is a basis for so many other things i.e. add some liver powder, yeast and shell fish extract for a 'natural' flavoured bait or bulk it out with bird food in the late spring for a high energy bait. You can do lots with this as a base....it doesn't cost much to mix up but that makes it good value not budget
sits back in to armchair again
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#305 17 Dec 2012 at 3.11pm | | |
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In reply to Post #297
Another point well worth considering is the protein content as it is very high in this mix, far too high imo especially considering the amino requirements are not quite met.
I prefer lower protein in winter.
Just my opinion and I am not knocking smurf or his mix, he suggested it as a budget mix anyway I think?
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#304 17 Dec 2012 at 2.04pm | | |
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In reply to Post #303
My thoughts on it would be, if you are winter fishing with say a hook bait and a two or three bait stringer, i.e. fishing for a bite, and if you are lucky catching A fish, it shouldn't be a problem, but if you are hoofing it in and they are hoovering it up, then I would say lower the oil content.
What are the chances of that though??
reverse psychology on that for me as far as im concerned-i do hoof it in during winter-and ive done pretty well as a result over the last few seasons, i just dont hoof it in whilst fishing-prefer to do it to a regime / frequency if you like around my fishing sessions, but equally you have to respect conditions beeing poorer than better -so you must fish when you feel theyres a chance-milder air temps,periods of lower pressure like the last few days for instance, afternoon sunshine, warmer wind direction-that sorta thing....i hoof it in to keep the fish in certain areas, and to keep them feeding-even if its very limited, those lipids get converted to energy-so i wouldnt take them out of the equation.
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#303 17 Dec 2012 at 10.49am | | |
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In reply to Post #302
My thoughts on it would be, if you are winter fishing with say a hook bait and a two or three bait stringer, i.e. fishing for a bite, and if you are lucky catching A fish, it shouldn't be a problem, but if you are hoofing it in and they are hoovering it up, then I would say lower the oil content.
What are the chances of that though??
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#302 17 Dec 2012 at 10.37am | | |
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In reply to Post #301
im going by smurfs recepie listed, but tweaks(if any) would be small-im not sure it would need an emulsifier, but i cannot see how it would hurt either sam, if to just keep the lipids from clotting.
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#301 17 Dec 2012 at 10.32am | | |
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In reply to Post #300
So you would tweek it then.
Also depends what ingredient options people are using.
If people have chosen sluis clo equivilant and lamlac the oil content would be much higher than other options
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#300 17 Dec 2012 at 10.26am | | |
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In reply to Post #299
i think thats an acceptable level-though i,d deffo use a thinner oil and at about 10-12ml per kg, simply as the mix has -heat treated soya within which retains 20% oil in its treatment.
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#299 17 Dec 2012 at 9.30am | | |
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In reply to Post #297
Fairly high oil in that mix, I wouldn't use it but if I had to I would at least tweak it and pop an emulsifier in there.
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#298 17 Dec 2012 at 7.39am | | |
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In reply to Post #297
I asked peter this and he said that hes used it through the winter months an caught more than his fair share of fish so the answerr is yes its ok.
If thats what Peter told you, That'd be good enough for me.
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#297 17 Dec 2012 at 6.38am | | |
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In reply to Post #296
ive been using bm1 with a couple of small tweeks,ive had conflicting advice and im not doubting anyone who has been good enough to help me out with advice,but some are saying bm1 isnt suitable for winter,others are saying its fine...is there a definitive answer???
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#296 13 Dec 2012 at 6.40am | | |
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Going to make this one a sticky, as post #77 gives probably the best bait advise anyone could wish for, Thanks, Peter
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#295 12 Nov 2012 at 10.52pm | | |
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In reply to Post #293
cheers for that mate yes i think there's so many different factors involved who knows
pm sent
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#294 12 Nov 2012 at 9.18pm | | |
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In reply to Post #292
wont be taking it out guy, just didnt really know what it was
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#293 12 Nov 2012 at 8.53pm | | |
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In reply to Post #292
That will be for half a kg then I am guessing? still an issue, especially as alot of it will be denatured by boiling
Lots of reasons why it could have caught more, and lots of other ingredients that could be the reason for it catching well
But well done all the same
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#292 12 Nov 2012 at 8.45pm | | |
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In reply to Post #280
gentleman please do not drop selenavite for anything else risk at ya peril you can buy it at the following ''vetuk .com £6.42+£1.99 p+p i sent off for mine on the wednesday and got it friday
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#291 12 Nov 2012 at 5.24pm | | |
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In reply to Post #282
gents please please do not take out the selenavite out i made up just a one egg mix and went down the lake for just a 24 hour session i was fishing a bm1 on one rod and a certain coconut bait on the other rod guy's it's bm1 3 coconut bait 0 i couldn't belive it chance or something else i don't know only the future can tell i'd just like to thank overbody who has pointed me in the right way and a certain gentleman called smurf
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#290 11 Nov 2012 at 10.10pm | | |
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In reply to Post #289
Definitely mate, can't wait to give it a try and roll my own baits.
I'll probably have a little play around with attractors etc in small batches.
It looks like a good basemix to get started with there is always scope for the odd tweak with the more I learn I suppose.
Cheers for your help
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#289 11 Nov 2012 at 9.57pm | | |
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@SamBarley, Yes mate, you are quite right to point that out. I Should have seen that myself. I agree if you take out the Selenavite E, there is not really anything you can replace that whole Vit/Min content with.
@gav1986, I messed around with BM1 and BM2 at the end of last year/beginning of this year, and settled on using the base mix as it is, but with CSL and Molasses as attractor liquids. I did start to add things like Betaine and Robin Red, but in the end i stopped playing around with them, so i could concentrate on the mixes i was putting together for myself.
I'd have to check but i think i settled on BM1 base mix, With CLO instead of Nectarblend, CSL, Molasses MSG and a few drops of Butyric acid. Don't discount BM2 though. I found it to be a cheaper alternative to BM1, and quite liked it once i sorted out a hardness problem.
Both are very good base mixes. Alot of peope owe Smurf a big
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#288 11 Nov 2012 at 9.40pm | | |
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In reply to Post #287
I won't be taking it out now I've realised what it does.
Nellieman - what attractors have you used with the basemix.
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#287 11 Nov 2012 at 9.37pm | | |
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In reply to Post #286
Obvious stuff for me and you nellieman but the poor guy might get the wrong end of the stick
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#286 11 Nov 2012 at 9.35pm | | |
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In reply to Post #284
Yes i understand that. But if he is swapping it out, why not use something else that may replace some of the vits and mins hes using.
Yes, to take the Selenavite out leaves a big hole in the vit min content, but he asked what he could swap it for.
I wasn't comparing anything. 
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#285 11 Nov 2012 at 9.30pm | | |
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In reply to Post #283
I understand now, to remove it would remove a high amount of vitamin and minerals. So it's probably better to keep in.
What attractor pack have you added to bm1?
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#284 11 Nov 2012 at 9.29pm | | |
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In reply to Post #283
All do completely different things.
Selenavite is used solely for vits and mins, the other ingredients can not come close to the vit/min content that selenavite contains
The other ingredients have other reasons for use, pointless comparing them, its like comparing sprouts to beef 
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#283 11 Nov 2012 at 9.25pm | | |
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In reply to Post #282
If i was to swap the Selenavite E out, i would probably swap it for another additive that is also high in vitamins and minerals, such as a seaweed product or brewers yeast or something similar. You could also swap it for a spice or herb additive such Fenugreek or Garlic. or even Paprika or Chilli Powder.
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#282 11 Nov 2012 at 9.19pm | | |
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In reply to Post #281
Cheers, just weighing up a few options before taking the plunge and rolling my own. The selenavite could be swapped for something like kelp powder or Glm I'm guessing?
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#281 11 Nov 2012 at 9.13pm | | |
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In reply to Post #280
Its a vitamin and mineral supplement made for horses. Some would say it makes a difference (me) some would say don't waste your time with it. Either way it is one of the better vit/min supplements to use in base mixes, so either use selenavite, or drop it altogether in favour of another additive/attractor.
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#280 11 Nov 2012 at 9.09pm | | |
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What does the selenavite e do for the base mix? Is there anything similar to swap it with?
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#279 11 Nov 2012 at 8.13pm | | |
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In reply to Post #278
Search for Selenavite E instead, but use half as much. A 500g tub is enough to do 20kg of BM1.
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#278 11 Nov 2012 at 7.18pm | | |
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What is this equivite? I can't seem to find it anywhere. Cheers pikeon
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#277 11 Nov 2012 at 5.02pm | | |
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In reply to Post #275
If I used flavours then yes I would use talin with any flavour
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#276 11 Nov 2012 at 4.59pm | | |
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In reply to Post #275
Give it a try and see what happens
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#275 11 Nov 2012 at 4.51pm | | |
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In reply to Post #274
Thanks, would you also use talin with a savoury flavour such as anchovy?
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#274 11 Nov 2012 at 4.25pm | | |
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In reply to Post #273
It depends how dense/heavy the other ingredients are- w germ is buoyant.
I'm gussing start with 3% with this bm1 mix and work from there.
Talin is my sweetener of choice
Yes mix the flavour with the egg before adding the base mix
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#273 11 Nov 2012 at 3.57pm | | |
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In reply to Post #272
Cheers Sam, the flavouring is mixed in with the egg? Should I use something like sweet ade with liquid flavours?
What kind of % would you use wheat germ?
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#272 11 Nov 2012 at 3.46pm | | |
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In reply to Post #271
First of all, I would certainly get a digestive aid in there, wheat germ is a cheap one with plenty of info available on it.
Even more important at this time of year.
Flavour wise it is worth using a sweetener with one, inclusion rates are on bottles.
Better still forget a flavour and add some garlic or chili instead- cheap and very effective
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#271 11 Nov 2012 at 3.39pm | | |
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Sorry to bring up an old thread.
I'm looking to roll my own, using smurfs bm1, at this stage I won't tweak it at all.
My question is about flavour/attractor. Do I only need to add my flavour, such as scopex or a fruit like nutrabsits wonderfruit? Or do I need to add anything with it?
Never rolled before so just need pointing in the right direction and ill try and work things out myself.
Can you give inclusion rates in a 1kg base mix?
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#270 23 Oct 2012 at 5.26am | | |
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In reply to Post #269
it was 10 g of betaine an not 25g.......just consulted my receipe and smurf (peter) suggested 10g
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#269 22 Oct 2012 at 8.42pm | | |
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In reply to Post #267
2.5% betaine = 25 grams
That much betaine Chop it down to 0.5% ... 5g is sufficient, MAX 10g.
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#268 21 Oct 2012 at 7.49pm | | |
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In reply to Post #267
I divided the mix that smurf posted and divided it by 9 (9eggs) to get the 1 egg mix - i used 1 large egg and it was perfect , not sticky at all . I used nectarblend instead of megablend , that was the only difference to original recipe
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#267 21 Oct 2012 at 4.49pm | | |
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In reply to Post #266
30% LT94 fishmeal = 300 grams
15% (supergold 60) = 150 grams
13% megablend= 130 grams
10% Semolina = 100 grams
10% Soya flour (heat treated) = 100 grams
8.5% pre-digested fishmeal = 85 grams
8.5% lamlac = 85 grams
2.5% Selenavite E = 25 grams
1 % betaine = 10 grams (EDIT...it was 10g,i just checked and smurf said drop it to 10g)
10% rred = 100 grams
3 mil of monster crab liquid
10 mil of hemp oil to help with rolling
this is my mix and something is making the mix really sticky after gunning it out,
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#266 21 Oct 2012 at 4.45pm | | |
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In reply to Post #263
was the base mix sticky at all??
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#265 21 Oct 2012 at 11.55am | | |
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In reply to Post #264
Haven't got a clue mate ! Can anyone recommend anything?
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#264 21 Oct 2012 at 11.45am | | |
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In reply to Post #263
You will get mixed advice RE betaine levels, my advice is do not go over 50 grams per ten kg of base mix.
What betaine will you be using?
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#263 21 Oct 2012 at 11.39am | | |
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In reply to Post #262
Made my 1st batch of BM1 today . A 1egg mix as I have never made boilies before. They turned out amazing , gunned out and rolled really easily.
So a big thank you to everyone who has contributed to this very informative thread
I did not add any other ingredients but will probably add a couple of attractor powders to my next "big" batch, thinking of betaine and L030 powder . Can anyone recommend how much of these would go into the base mix ?
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#262 18 Oct 2012 at 1.32pm | | |
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In reply to Post #261
I asked peter this and he said that hes used it through the winter months an caught more than his fair share of fish so the answerr is yes its ok.
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#261 17 Oct 2012 at 6.17pm | | |
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In reply to Post #260
Quick question , is the BM1 basemix suitable all through the year?
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#260 9 Sept 2012 at 9.32pm | | |
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In reply to Post #259
Thanks guys
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#259 9 Sept 2012 at 9.11pm | | |
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In reply to Post #258
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#258 9 Sept 2012 at 8.07pm | | |
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In reply to Post #257
They wil be fine just dnt boil the backend out them.
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#257 9 Sept 2012 at 6.39pm | | |
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In reply to Post #255
Will they still be soft enough to get a needle through though, I'm not having to deal with Crays etc?
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#256 9 Sept 2012 at 5.56pm | | |
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Any thoughts on the free amino acids available in the mix?
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#255 9 Sept 2012 at 5.21pm | | |
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In reply to Post #254
Whey gel for me everytime where hard hookers needed, drives out moisture and gives a harder finished bait throughout than standard wpc80.
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#254 8 Sept 2012 at 7.27pm | | |
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In reply to Post #253
Before i do though, what are the pros and cons of each of Albumin, WPC and Whey Gel?
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#253 8 Sept 2012 at 5.05pm | | |
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In reply to Post #252
Ok, thanks guys, back to the rolling board!!
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#252 8 Sept 2012 at 3.46pm | | |
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In reply to Post #249
Or blood powder for the cheaper option (just as effective for that purpose)
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#251 8 Sept 2012 at 3.11pm | | |
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In reply to Post #250
Between 5 and 10% egg albumin and/or WPC should be fine. Otherwise as he says....hookbaits only
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#250 8 Sept 2012 at 2.53pm | | |
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In reply to Post #249
You can make hardened hookbaits by adding 10% Egg albumin.
Do this only on the hookbaits.
Soft baits are more attractive in my mind the rock solid ones.
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#249 8 Sept 2012 at 2.01pm | | |
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In reply to Post #248
Just done a session with the BM1 that was slower than the previous one shall we say and one thing I have noticed is that they go too soft for my liking as hookbaits and invariably I was winding in an empty rig in the morning. Currently I am boiling for 90 seconds then drying for 24. I now realise the situation may have been made worse because I had then put them in an airdry bag when I got to he lake. From what I have read on here it appears that the drier the bait the quicker it takes on water and goes soft quicker?? Thoughts??
Also from my searching on here it looks like you can add Egg Albumin or Whey Protein Concentrate to toughen them up a bit.
What would you recommend for inclusion rates in the BM1 mix to get the desired effect? Also, would it be best to make up separate batches of hookbaits for the purpose or make the whole mix tougher, if you see what I mean?
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#248 2 Sept 2012 at 11.24am | | |
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Dose anybody know if there is a difference between vitamealo milk powderand topaz calf milk replacement.
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#247 1 Sept 2012 at 9.54pm | | |
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In reply to Post #246
yes and yes
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#246 1 Sept 2012 at 8.59pm | | |
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I know this is not the best mix ever but as a first mix will this roll and catch fish.
30% Standard Fishmeal
20% C.L.O
33% Semo
10% Soya flour
7% vitamealo milk powder
Cod liver oil 20mm
Molassesa 30mm
Squid & octopus flavour
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#245 1 Sept 2012 at 7.47pm | | |
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Just made up the first batch and I ended up using 13 eggs. Don't know if the eggs were just small but it was a very stiff mix.
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#244 27 Aug 2012 at 9.16pm | | |
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In reply to Post #241
2.5 % is not too much on that mix Limey.
But remember you can get usefull vits from products such as brewers yeast and kelp meal/powder
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#243 27 Aug 2012 at 9.13pm | | |
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In reply to Post #241
Im no bait buff mate...i spoke to peter (smurf) and went with his reccomendations tbh...im a rookie learning
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#242 27 Aug 2012 at 6.46pm | | |
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In reply to Post #241
If you want the optimal dosage of MSG for a nutritional bait it would be zero% but in almost every bait I have made I use a heaped teaspoon in 1kg.
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#241 27 Aug 2012 at 6.37pm | | |
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In reply to Post #240
Doesn´t 2.5% Selenavite E = 25g/kg(5 teaspoons) sound abit too much, compared to only 10g/kg of Cyprivit What´s the optimal dosage of MSG in a kilo mix ... 10-20g
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#240 25 Aug 2012 at 7.14pm | | |
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In reply to Post #239
almost,i added monster crab liquid,hemp oil and robin red as i wanted them more of a darker red,they wernt perfect but ive spoken to peter and hes give me a couple of pointers,it was more to do with how i rolled it and not the base mix..i really enjoyed doing it and im going to have another go this week
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#239 24 Aug 2012 at 10.29pm | | |
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In reply to Post #232
Nice baits there. My first attempts at bait making (admittedly over 20 years ago) looked nothing like that. Misshapen sticky balls would be more accurate!
Must get round to knocking some of this up. Did you follow Smurf's exact recipe?
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#238 22 Aug 2012 at 4.18pm | | |
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In reply to Post #237
Personally I leave them for a good 12 hours if not a little longer. Some do more some do less but 'overnight' would be a good starting point
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#237 22 Aug 2012 at 4.08pm | | |
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In reply to Post #236
how long should i leave these out to dry before freezing them please??
thx
andy
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#236 22 Aug 2012 at 1.26pm | | |
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In reply to Post #232
Thats how it all starts
I just did 1/2K...then i just did a little bit more, then before I knew it I was up to a couple of K's a week and now I can't stop 
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#235 22 Aug 2012 at 11.37am | | |
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In reply to Post #234
What additives did you use in the end?
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#234 22 Aug 2012 at 11.35am | | |
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In reply to Post #233
im so made up,i really enjoyed doing it,i just made a 5 egg mix initially thinking i was going to be in a whole load of mess but everything went so well it was untrue
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#233 22 Aug 2012 at 11.32am | | |
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In reply to Post #232
hmm, lovely
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#232 22 Aug 2012 at 11.29am | | |
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In reply to Post #219
my first ever batch of boilies
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