In reply to Post #192
It seems that the real problem with an 'universal' vaccine is that their are so many strains of Lepto so rather like the flue jab any vaccination will only cover for 'regional' strains. Ken and I have chatted via pm on this and quite frankly the whole thing is rather confusing. In our case we have had innoculations and had the certificates that clearly state that it is for Lepto'. I presume that this is for the strains that are prevelant in our area of France (or possibly France as a whole) and may not give protection outside the area concerned. I have copied below an extract on a scientific paper on the subject that I pm'd to ken which possibly explains our situation but not the international one.
"Some people have more risk of catching the disease because of the nature of their job or their lifestyle. En ville, les catégories les plus exposées sont les égoutiers, les éboueurs et les employés des abattoirs. In town, the groups most at risk are sewer, waste handlers and employees of slaughterhouses. A la campagne, les fermiers et les personnes qui vivent à proximité des animaux ou n'ayant pas accès aux mesures de salubrité (absence de canalisation d'assainissement, d'eau potable ou traitée, non utilisation de bottes et gants dans leurs travaux quotidiens...). In the countryside, farmers and people living near the animals or not having access to the safety (lack of pipeline sanitation, drinking water or treated, non-use of boots and gloves in their daily work ...). Par ailleurs, les loisirs d'eau douce comme la pêche, le kayak et la baignade peuvent également comporter un risque. In addition, recreation freshwater fishing, kayaking and swimming may also involve risks. En principe, les catégories professionnelles exposées doivent bénéficier d'une vaccination comme c'est le cas en France par exemple où la leptospirose est considérée comme une maladie professionnelle. In principle, the occupational groups exposed should receive vaccination as is the case in France for example where leptospirosis is considered an occupational disease".
One further point is that as Lepto is a bacterial infection it is rather like Tetanus (bacterial) in as much vaccination is possible.
It seems that the real problem with an 'universal' vaccine is that their are so many strains of Lepto so rather like the flue jab any vaccination will only cover for 'regional' strains. Ken and I have chatted via pm on this and quite frankly the whole thing is rather confusing. In our case we have had innoculations and had the certificates that clearly state that it is for Lepto'. I presume that this is for the strains that are prevelant in our area of France (or possibly France as a whole) and may not give protection outside the area concerned. I have copied below an extract on a scientific paper on the subject that I pm'd to ken which possibly explains our situation but not the international one.
"Some people have more risk of catching the disease because of the nature of their job or their lifestyle. En ville, les catégories les plus exposées sont les égoutiers, les éboueurs et les employés des abattoirs. In town, the groups most at risk are sewer, waste handlers and employees of slaughterhouses. A la campagne, les fermiers et les personnes qui vivent à proximité des animaux ou n'ayant pas accès aux mesures de salubrité (absence de canalisation d'assainissement, d'eau potable ou traitée, non utilisation de bottes et gants dans leurs travaux quotidiens...). In the countryside, farmers and people living near the animals or not having access to the safety (lack of pipeline sanitation, drinking water or treated, non-use of boots and gloves in their daily work ...). Par ailleurs, les loisirs d'eau douce comme la pêche, le kayak et la baignade peuvent également comporter un risque. In addition, recreation freshwater fishing, kayaking and swimming may also involve risks. En principe, les catégories professionnelles exposées doivent bénéficier d'une vaccination comme c'est le cas en France par exemple où la leptospirose est considérée comme une maladie professionnelle. In principle, the occupational groups exposed should receive vaccination as is the case in France for example where leptospirosis is considered an occupational disease".
One further point is that as Lepto is a bacterial infection it is rather like Tetanus (bacterial) in as much vaccination is possible.
Right guys...I don't want to get into a row with anyone, so this will be my last word on the subject of a vaccine.
According to the World Health Organisation only ONE vaccine has been licensed in the wold, and that is the one Jim mentions, the Weils Disease and Akiyami Combined Vaccine, developed by Denka Seiken Co Ltd, Tokyo.
The company has NO exportation certificate and the drug is not available outside Japan. It is "possibly" (WHO's word) thought to offer limited protection against three specific LPT serovars out of a known 230. The WHO does not recognise this therapy as an effective vaccination against Weils Disease, though it does acknowledge its use against a tiny number of LPT infections. However, the WHO has not licensed this vaccine for export or for use outside Japan.
This is the ONLY vaccine currently in use in the world and it does not protect against 99% of known serovars and is ONLY available in Japan. China is working on an effective vaccine but admits it is nowhere near finding one as yet.
I am not scaremongering here. I for one would welcome a vaccine with open arms, as would the pharmaceutical industry that stands to make $billions in revenue from the sale of a successful fully licensed vaccine. All I am trying to point out to my French friends is that there is NO current vaccine available in France that is effective protection against Weils Disease.
The WHO states that outside the far east, France has the largest incidence of Weils disease in the western world. If they DID have a vaccine (which they don't) then it's not working.
JIM: this is for you...I am no doctor, but in this instance I think I can say with 100% certainty that the vaccination you have received is NOT going to protect you against Weils Disease. Please continue to take all the necessary precautions to prevent infection...and that goes for everyone both here and abroad.
(It should be noted that lepto infections occur frequently and are always treatable with antibiotics should the infection get so far as to require treatment. Quite often the infection clears up and goes away - often untreated - after causing the patient to suffer nothing more than what appears to be a bad cold. Leptospirosis infection in and of itself is unpleasant but not lethal, whereas Weils - the result of a deepening of the infection - can be lethal. This infection DOES NOT clear up: indeed it worsens and becomes Weils Disease)
Please, guys, do not be sidetracked by this discussion about the availabilty or otherwise of a vaccine. There is NO vaccine licensed for use in Europe. None whatsoever. Next time you see you doctor, ask him and he will tell you the same thing. So PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE keep safe out on the bank, or you may end up a dead man walking.
According to the World Health Organisation only ONE vaccine has been licensed in the wold, and that is the one Jim mentions, the Weils Disease and Akiyami Combined Vaccine, developed by Denka Seiken Co Ltd, Tokyo.
The company has NO exportation certificate and the drug is not available outside Japan. It is "possibly" (WHO's word) thought to offer limited protection against three specific LPT serovars out of a known 230. The WHO does not recognise this therapy as an effective vaccination against Weils Disease, though it does acknowledge its use against a tiny number of LPT infections. However, the WHO has not licensed this vaccine for export or for use outside Japan.
This is the ONLY vaccine currently in use in the world and it does not protect against 99% of known serovars and is ONLY available in Japan. China is working on an effective vaccine but admits it is nowhere near finding one as yet.
I am not scaremongering here. I for one would welcome a vaccine with open arms, as would the pharmaceutical industry that stands to make $billions in revenue from the sale of a successful fully licensed vaccine. All I am trying to point out to my French friends is that there is NO current vaccine available in France that is effective protection against Weils Disease.
The WHO states that outside the far east, France has the largest incidence of Weils disease in the western world. If they DID have a vaccine (which they don't) then it's not working.
JIM: this is for you...I am no doctor, but in this instance I think I can say with 100% certainty that the vaccination you have received is NOT going to protect you against Weils Disease. Please continue to take all the necessary precautions to prevent infection...and that goes for everyone both here and abroad.
(It should be noted that lepto infections occur frequently and are always treatable with antibiotics should the infection get so far as to require treatment. Quite often the infection clears up and goes away - often untreated - after causing the patient to suffer nothing more than what appears to be a bad cold. Leptospirosis infection in and of itself is unpleasant but not lethal, whereas Weils - the result of a deepening of the infection - can be lethal. This infection DOES NOT clear up: indeed it worsens and becomes Weils Disease)
Please, guys, do not be sidetracked by this discussion about the availabilty or otherwise of a vaccine. There is NO vaccine licensed for use in Europe. None whatsoever. Next time you see you doctor, ask him and he will tell you the same thing. So PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE keep safe out on the bank, or you may end up a dead man walking.
In reply to Post #196
hi guys i did post early on in this thread and while at the carp show i found one of these.
now you can protect your self a bit more,and not have to carry water on any venue....
http://www.carpforum.co.uk/Shared/Messages.asp?TopicID=192684
used by our soldiers in the field.if we can get enough interest may be they will do forum members a discount....
hi guys i did post early on in this thread and while at the carp show i found one of these.
now you can protect your self a bit more,and not have to carry water on any venue....
http://www.carpforum.co.uk/Shared/Messages.asp?TopicID=192684
used by our soldiers in the field.if we can get enough interest may be they will do forum members a discount....
In reply to Post #197
As stated in the other thread, sounds a good idea in principle but I feel that there are questions left unanswered that need addressing before considering this product as stated in my post #27 of the thread you link to.
wraith
As stated in the other thread, sounds a good idea in principle but I feel that there are questions left unanswered that need addressing before considering this product as stated in my post #27 of the thread you link to.
wraith
In reply to Post #199
your questions have been forwarded to them mate and very good ones they are
your questions have been forwarded to them mate and very good ones they are
In reply to Post #200
VERY VERY VERY good thread, I myself have been aware of this disease since i started fishing over 20 years ago. I had it drummed into me by my father to be vigilant about cathing it and he always made sure i kept clean while fishing, and never left anything lying about (food/bait) and i have carried on doing this to this day. But my missus is a nurse so i now get all my hand gels for nothing and there very good too i even wipe my banksticks over with it just for piece of mind.
VERY VERY VERY good thread, I myself have been aware of this disease since i started fishing over 20 years ago. I had it drummed into me by my father to be vigilant about cathing it and he always made sure i kept clean while fishing, and never left anything lying about (food/bait) and i have carried on doing this to this day. But my missus is a nurse so i now get all my hand gels for nothing and there very good too i even wipe my banksticks over with it just for piece of mind.
I know that I'm guilty in the past for Kissing fish after capture, and even tried before netting them (different story), but I carry an Antibacterial Gel I got from a Builders Equipment Supplier, to try to reduce the risks. Comes in handy for a couple of reasons. Working as a Store Detective, some of the scroats who we stopped were filthy (and I mean Disgusting), and it does also Kill the Weils disease bacteria.
All food is bagged and Pans etc are never left out out.
I've even got to the stage that my Baccy and Ciggie Papers are kept in the pocket of my combats rather than being left on my Tackle Box
I know that if I do ever get a Flu or Bad Cold I go straight to my Doctors or Local Emergency Clinic and explain the risks of Leptospirosis. Just about the first thing they always do is stick you on a 10 day course of Antibiotics, as opposed to the usual 7day and give you strict warnings that if any symptoms become worse to get back there or to A&E. Thank Goodness I have only ever had to go to A&E once when the flu progressed to a severe Headache. The nurses weren't too happy as they thought I was pulling a fast one, but once explained and they checked in the Big Black Book in the Nurses station were damn happy to keep me in for a nights observation.
Weils disease can be spread by many other rodents and animals, not just Rats.
All food is bagged and Pans etc are never left out out.
I've even got to the stage that my Baccy and Ciggie Papers are kept in the pocket of my combats rather than being left on my Tackle Box
I know that if I do ever get a Flu or Bad Cold I go straight to my Doctors or Local Emergency Clinic and explain the risks of Leptospirosis. Just about the first thing they always do is stick you on a 10 day course of Antibiotics, as opposed to the usual 7day and give you strict warnings that if any symptoms become worse to get back there or to A&E. Thank Goodness I have only ever had to go to A&E once when the flu progressed to a severe Headache. The nurses weren't too happy as they thought I was pulling a fast one, but once explained and they checked in the Big Black Book in the Nurses station were damn happy to keep me in for a nights observation.
Weils disease can be spread by many other rodents and animals, not just Rats.
why do people kiss fish FFS if you put somthing to your mouth out of a rat infested water you deserve to catch weils disease.... 
In reply to Post #203
As for the card info thing this is the exact info the EA should have put on the back of the new license this year.
If anyone from the EA is on here please take note and include it next year ( also make the card a reuasble real plastic card that you top up at the posty each year - Smart card style this would cut the need to re supply cards each year )
Spot on post Ken good to bring it to the forfront of anglers minds. The hand gels ae available all over the place these dys and dirt cheap no excuse for not having a bottle or two in your tackle. I have carried at least one on all sessions for the last few years.
As for the card info thing this is the exact info the EA should have put on the back of the new license this year.
If anyone from the EA is on here please take note and include it next year ( also make the card a reuasble real plastic card that you top up at the posty each year - Smart card style this would cut the need to re supply cards each year )
Spot on post Ken good to bring it to the forfront of anglers minds. The hand gels ae available all over the place these dys and dirt cheap no excuse for not having a bottle or two in your tackle. I have carried at least one on all sessions for the last few years.
In reply to Post #204
Sorry to revive an old thread........
Do you think boiling water helps against Weils Disease ?
That is, using it to wash pans ect........
Sorry to revive an old thread........
Do you think boiling water helps against Weils Disease ?
That is, using it to wash pans ect........
In reply to Post #205
using boiling water should kill off any nastys that maybe lurking
using boiling water should kill off any nastys that maybe lurking
In reply to Post #206
I've always done this as a matter of course over the years and thought it must kill all the nasty bugs that are lying around waiting to infect.
I've always done this as a matter of course over the years and thought it must kill all the nasty bugs that are lying around waiting to infect.
In reply to Post #207
So am i right in saying all anti bacteria wipes are strong enough to kill weils disease ?i see in a earlier post that someone uses baby wipes are these strong enough to be effective ?
So am i right in saying all anti bacteria wipes are strong enough to kill weils disease ?i see in a earlier post that someone uses baby wipes are these strong enough to be effective ?
In reply to Post #208
This has opened my eyes. Will be approaching things differently now. Why do people who win Fish O Mania always jump in the water at the end. I have just got back from France and was in the water for some pics and to land fish. Glad i have come across this as my knowledge was not up to scratch in this particular area.
This has opened my eyes. Will be approaching things differently now. Why do people who win Fish O Mania always jump in the water at the end. I have just got back from France and was in the water for some pics and to land fish. Glad i have come across this as my knowledge was not up to scratch in this particular area.
In reply to Post #209
How you doing now Ken?
This has opened my eyes to the dangers of this disease and more should be done to inform ALL anglers of the dangers.
Abit off topic but 6 month ago yesterday, i was bit by a contaminated Mosquito in Florida whilst on one of them air boats on a lake looking for Aligators with my kids, within a week of being home i was seriously ill in hospital with a Brain Virus and our Dr's never had a clue what was wrong with me until the M.O.D returned my blood results.
Its taken nearly 6 month to get back to my old self and even now i still have a few bad days.
We all have to becarefull.
How you doing now Ken?
This has opened my eyes to the dangers of this disease and more should be done to inform ALL anglers of the dangers.
Abit off topic but 6 month ago yesterday, i was bit by a contaminated Mosquito in Florida whilst on one of them air boats on a lake looking for Aligators with my kids, within a week of being home i was seriously ill in hospital with a Brain Virus and our Dr's never had a clue what was wrong with me until the M.O.D returned my blood results.
Its taken nearly 6 month to get back to my old self and even now i still have a few bad days.
We all have to becarefull.